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1st Posted Racial Build - Atan
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<blockquote data-quote="Khaalis" data-source="post: 1526678" data-attributes="member: 2167"><p>First thanks for the replies, I was starting to wonder…</p><p></p><p><strong>Mass reply…</strong></p><p></p><p>This is my bad, as it is a based on a homebrew system I use for Race classification. They are <em>Humanoid</em> type by standard classification. In my grouping of races (I compile races from many different sources), they are Humanoid, but considered Giant Kin for D&D purposes. It tends to explain them a little better and makes them a much more “fitting” racial option than Half-Giants and Half-Ogres.</p><p></p><p></p><p>The size issue is for various reasons. Again, the race is being designed from D&D mechanics terms as a more Humanoid (and non-psionic) replacement to the Half-Giant and Half-Ogre. Also, Atans are much larger than other humanoids, but in the average of 7’ (not 9-10’) and are exceptionally skilled at warcraft, especially unarmed combat. To reflect both of these points, I took a lead from both of the other races and took Powerful Build over “Large Size”. This removes the 10’ reach ability which immediately adds another +1 LA, and is too often badly abused with the Chain+Large+Trip build. As for the suggestion to use “Large but specifically limiting their reach” is something I wouldn’t want to do. I prefer to use an existing racial ability, as is from the books, than to put a special restriction on another. If that makes sense.</p><p></p><p>It also removes the Half-Dragon Free Wings issue. They will NOT receive wings for the Half-Dragon. For +3, PC’s were never meant to get wings. Keep in Mind that the “Winged” template is +2 LA on its own.</p><p></p><p></p><p>For stats, I didn’t want to go overboard or to make them in need of a +1 LA just from unbalanced stats.</p><p>+2 Str is a given, and was the easy part. Now that I think of it though the +2 Con is not necessary as a lot of this is covered by the Endurance feat. The problem with a +2 to Charisma is that even though the race is attractive and “can be charismatic” (as can Elves) it is not something the entire race is known for. Many are quite gruff and aloof, many outright hating outsiders. I chose not to penalize Wisdom because their tendencies for communication and cooperation are derived more from their philosophical views and training than from personality traits. They run their life based on sets of rituals and defined principles of philosophy. This to me described a race that is not penalized in their Wisdom. They are however, not the brightest bulbs in the box, thus the penalty to Intelligence. It is possible to be dumb but wise at the same time. </p><p></p><p>The best compromise I see would be no bonus nor penalty to Charisma or Wisdom and thus: +2 Str, +2 Con, -2 Int</p><p>This would lock them into a +2 LA.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The problem with this is D&D mechanics. In the novels this worked, its fiction, and technically all Atans would be classified as “Monks” with the monk’s AC bonus. But in D&D it doesn’t work so well. Not everyone will be Monks, and I don’t think that assigning a Monk’s AC bonus to a Race is a good idea. I just wasn’t keen on restricting the race completely from the use of armor. That’s really a crippling penalty in D&D - even if you gave them +4 or +6 natural armor. Not only will their AC continually get worse on the average curve, and at higher levels this is a PC killer when a melee type needs a 25+ AC, but they also lose out on the ability to utilize any armor based magic items.</p><p></p><p></p><p>I wasn’t so sure I wanted to load them up with ALL of the feats as bonuses. They get 3 of the 4. The other unarmed feat they can take if they choose.</p><p></p><p></p><p>I don’t think a +2 is worthy of a full +1 LA. If it were a +4 or higher bonus I would agree. Though I am trying to keep it to a Low ECL race. I don’t personally like ECL 4 or 5 races with no HD.</p><p></p><p></p><p>This could work, but I think it’s a little too extreme. I don’t have the book handy but for some reason I think I found Jotunbrud to be a little off, not to mention Non OGL. The Powerful Build racial ability is now posted in other official WotC sources and is/will be considered an OGL abilty. As for the running, I think the Run and Endurance really need to go together. It is what the race is most famous for. I could agree to adding Imp.Trip as an option with the others, but I see it as more a specific tactic than a fighting style like Unarmed Strike (Boxing) vs. Grapple (Wrestling).</p><p></p><p></p><p>This is a good comment that can be added into the flavor text of the race, but has no real impact on the mechanics of the class. I’ll work on working this in.</p><p></p><p></p><p>The balance factor on the feats is that only 1 is truly an impactive feat – the combat feat. Run and Endurance are flavor feats for most intensive purposes. </p><p></p><p>If I keep it to the following – what ECL would people lean toward? I think still +2 LA. What if it were to drop the +2 CON and +2 Intimidate?</p><p></p><p>+2 Str, +2 Con, -2 Int</p><p>Medium Humanoid; Base Speed 30’</p><p></p><p>Benefits:</p><p>+2 Natural Armor</p><p>4 Bonus Feats: Improved Unarmed OR Improved Grapple, + Run, Endurance, Exotic Armor (Atan)</p><p>Powerful Build</p><p>+2 Intimidate</p><p></p><p>Penalties:</p><p>Giant Kin (affected by spells/effects of both Giant and Humanoid)</p><p>Armor Penalty: All other armor = x2 non-proficient penalty unless have the feats, then x1 non-proficient penalty.</p><p>Costly Living</p><p></p><p>Thoughts?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Khaalis, post: 1526678, member: 2167"] First thanks for the replies, I was starting to wonder… [b]Mass reply…[/b] This is my bad, as it is a based on a homebrew system I use for Race classification. They are [i]Humanoid[/i] type by standard classification. In my grouping of races (I compile races from many different sources), they are Humanoid, but considered Giant Kin for D&D purposes. It tends to explain them a little better and makes them a much more “fitting” racial option than Half-Giants and Half-Ogres. The size issue is for various reasons. Again, the race is being designed from D&D mechanics terms as a more Humanoid (and non-psionic) replacement to the Half-Giant and Half-Ogre. Also, Atans are much larger than other humanoids, but in the average of 7’ (not 9-10’) and are exceptionally skilled at warcraft, especially unarmed combat. To reflect both of these points, I took a lead from both of the other races and took Powerful Build over “Large Size”. This removes the 10’ reach ability which immediately adds another +1 LA, and is too often badly abused with the Chain+Large+Trip build. As for the suggestion to use “Large but specifically limiting their reach” is something I wouldn’t want to do. I prefer to use an existing racial ability, as is from the books, than to put a special restriction on another. If that makes sense. It also removes the Half-Dragon Free Wings issue. They will NOT receive wings for the Half-Dragon. For +3, PC’s were never meant to get wings. Keep in Mind that the “Winged” template is +2 LA on its own. For stats, I didn’t want to go overboard or to make them in need of a +1 LA just from unbalanced stats. +2 Str is a given, and was the easy part. Now that I think of it though the +2 Con is not necessary as a lot of this is covered by the Endurance feat. The problem with a +2 to Charisma is that even though the race is attractive and “can be charismatic” (as can Elves) it is not something the entire race is known for. Many are quite gruff and aloof, many outright hating outsiders. I chose not to penalize Wisdom because their tendencies for communication and cooperation are derived more from their philosophical views and training than from personality traits. They run their life based on sets of rituals and defined principles of philosophy. This to me described a race that is not penalized in their Wisdom. They are however, not the brightest bulbs in the box, thus the penalty to Intelligence. It is possible to be dumb but wise at the same time. The best compromise I see would be no bonus nor penalty to Charisma or Wisdom and thus: +2 Str, +2 Con, -2 Int This would lock them into a +2 LA. The problem with this is D&D mechanics. In the novels this worked, its fiction, and technically all Atans would be classified as “Monks” with the monk’s AC bonus. But in D&D it doesn’t work so well. Not everyone will be Monks, and I don’t think that assigning a Monk’s AC bonus to a Race is a good idea. I just wasn’t keen on restricting the race completely from the use of armor. That’s really a crippling penalty in D&D - even if you gave them +4 or +6 natural armor. Not only will their AC continually get worse on the average curve, and at higher levels this is a PC killer when a melee type needs a 25+ AC, but they also lose out on the ability to utilize any armor based magic items. I wasn’t so sure I wanted to load them up with ALL of the feats as bonuses. They get 3 of the 4. The other unarmed feat they can take if they choose. I don’t think a +2 is worthy of a full +1 LA. If it were a +4 or higher bonus I would agree. Though I am trying to keep it to a Low ECL race. I don’t personally like ECL 4 or 5 races with no HD. This could work, but I think it’s a little too extreme. I don’t have the book handy but for some reason I think I found Jotunbrud to be a little off, not to mention Non OGL. The Powerful Build racial ability is now posted in other official WotC sources and is/will be considered an OGL abilty. As for the running, I think the Run and Endurance really need to go together. It is what the race is most famous for. I could agree to adding Imp.Trip as an option with the others, but I see it as more a specific tactic than a fighting style like Unarmed Strike (Boxing) vs. Grapple (Wrestling). This is a good comment that can be added into the flavor text of the race, but has no real impact on the mechanics of the class. I’ll work on working this in. The balance factor on the feats is that only 1 is truly an impactive feat – the combat feat. Run and Endurance are flavor feats for most intensive purposes. If I keep it to the following – what ECL would people lean toward? I think still +2 LA. What if it were to drop the +2 CON and +2 Intimidate? +2 Str, +2 Con, -2 Int Medium Humanoid; Base Speed 30’ Benefits: +2 Natural Armor 4 Bonus Feats: Improved Unarmed OR Improved Grapple, + Run, Endurance, Exotic Armor (Atan) Powerful Build +2 Intimidate Penalties: Giant Kin (affected by spells/effects of both Giant and Humanoid) Armor Penalty: All other armor = x2 non-proficient penalty unless have the feats, then x1 non-proficient penalty. Costly Living Thoughts? [/QUOTE]
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