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<blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 9588460" data-attributes="member: 6790260"><p>There is a converse side to this "efficiency."</p><p></p><p>On one-for-one terms, spells are always the most efficient way to do a thing. Get through a door? There are spells, plural, for that. Learn a piece of information? Man, we've got spells <em>galore</em>. So on the very very small term (as in, "what can you achieve with a single action?"), spells are more efficient. And then on the long term, averaged over several adventuring days where the caster can adapt spells over time to better suit an adventure, spells again rise in efficiency, especially when players are able to take rests more or less when they like. It's only on the medium-term, for long adventuring days where casters are locked in and martials <em>get enough time</em> to do their stuff, that efficiency favors them over casters. Martial solutions are <em>time</em> inefficient on the short and long term, but time efficient on the medium term.</p><p></p><p>But by and large, all this is saying is "spells are more complicated to use than basic things are to use." Nobody has questioned that. We are assuming that both players are playing smart. Not hyperintelligent prescient geniuses, but...just being a smart player and trying to leverage things.</p><p></p><p>Min-maxing is a thing. You go in aware of the weaknesses, and take steps to mitigate them. Long Rest early and often, so you have the most resources you can get. Select broadly useful, effective spells, not ultra-niche weird spells. Remember that creatures succeed on their saving throws sometimes, so favor spells that don't need them or target typically weak saves. Scope out your opposition/obstacles in advance, so you can prepare.</p><p></p><p>Like, you seem to be thinking that what people are saying is "spellcasters are beter AND EASIER", and that couldn't be further from the truth. Spellcasters "pay" for their power with a higher skill floor. But the skill ceiling is out in outer space, while the skill ceiling of martial characters barely rises above sea level.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="EzekielRaiden, post: 9588460, member: 6790260"] There is a converse side to this "efficiency." On one-for-one terms, spells are always the most efficient way to do a thing. Get through a door? There are spells, plural, for that. Learn a piece of information? Man, we've got spells [I]galore[/I]. So on the very very small term (as in, "what can you achieve with a single action?"), spells are more efficient. And then on the long term, averaged over several adventuring days where the caster can adapt spells over time to better suit an adventure, spells again rise in efficiency, especially when players are able to take rests more or less when they like. It's only on the medium-term, for long adventuring days where casters are locked in and martials [I]get enough time[/I] to do their stuff, that efficiency favors them over casters. Martial solutions are [I]time[/I] inefficient on the short and long term, but time efficient on the medium term. But by and large, all this is saying is "spells are more complicated to use than basic things are to use." Nobody has questioned that. We are assuming that both players are playing smart. Not hyperintelligent prescient geniuses, but...just being a smart player and trying to leverage things. Min-maxing is a thing. You go in aware of the weaknesses, and take steps to mitigate them. Long Rest early and often, so you have the most resources you can get. Select broadly useful, effective spells, not ultra-niche weird spells. Remember that creatures succeed on their saving throws sometimes, so favor spells that don't need them or target typically weak saves. Scope out your opposition/obstacles in advance, so you can prepare. Like, you seem to be thinking that what people are saying is "spellcasters are beter AND EASIER", and that couldn't be further from the truth. Spellcasters "pay" for their power with a higher skill floor. But the skill ceiling is out in outer space, while the skill ceiling of martial characters barely rises above sea level. [/QUOTE]
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