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2024 needs to end 2014's passive aggressive efforts to remove magic items & other elements from d&d
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<blockquote data-quote="DEFCON 1" data-source="post: 9213907" data-attributes="member: 7006"><p>I understand your scenario here and understand your complaints about this situation... but I will tell you from my perspective why this complaint doesn't seem to hold much weight for me. Because it assumes that the game itself doesn't give the players/DM any choice in the matter. That they are just stuck having to face off against this naga again in a few levels and be just as bad at facing it as they were several months previous.</p><p></p><p>But that's not true. The DM has <em>chosen</em> to put their players up against this naga again. The DM has known going in that their players are going to have just as bad a time of it now (even at their higher level) as they did last time. And it seems to me that that's exactly the point. The DM <em>wanting</em> to throw a difficult encounter against the group, and where the party just happens to have that one achilles heel against them regardless of how strong they have gotten through the campaign.</p><p></p><p>D&D is not a game where there is a standardized "power level" for every single type of creature in the game, and as the PCs gain power, every creature's power begins to fall away equally. Like a naga that was a certain power level when the party was 3rd level needs to be demonstrably less powerful when the group is at 9th. That's not at all how this game has been designed. And we know this because the game is set up to allow us to build creatures at whatever power level we wish. Default kobolds from the MM are CR 1/8... but any DM out there can just build a kobold using the PC rules and thus throw out an 18th level Fighter kobold against the party if they want. So the party had a certain difficulty against kobolds at the beginning on the campaign, and had the same difficulty against some kobolds three years and 15 levels later. Or you have twelve different types of zombie, each of them at a different CR and the party will face those zombies over and over again, all of them always seeming to be a challenge. So we can't say there is or should be an expectation of monster power level depending on PC level. That just doesn't happen. Players can and will run up against all manner of power level for every single creature out there.</p><p></p><p>Thus to my mind... the fact that this particular naga does not get weaker against the party <em>across the board</em> (but rather only in certain ways) is nothing that seems wrong. Facing off against a monster that gains or loses differing levels of power in their abilities depending on which part of the monster's features we are talking about seems completely normal.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="DEFCON 1, post: 9213907, member: 7006"] I understand your scenario here and understand your complaints about this situation... but I will tell you from my perspective why this complaint doesn't seem to hold much weight for me. Because it assumes that the game itself doesn't give the players/DM any choice in the matter. That they are just stuck having to face off against this naga again in a few levels and be just as bad at facing it as they were several months previous. But that's not true. The DM has [I]chosen[/I] to put their players up against this naga again. The DM has known going in that their players are going to have just as bad a time of it now (even at their higher level) as they did last time. And it seems to me that that's exactly the point. The DM [I]wanting[/I] to throw a difficult encounter against the group, and where the party just happens to have that one achilles heel against them regardless of how strong they have gotten through the campaign. D&D is not a game where there is a standardized "power level" for every single type of creature in the game, and as the PCs gain power, every creature's power begins to fall away equally. Like a naga that was a certain power level when the party was 3rd level needs to be demonstrably less powerful when the group is at 9th. That's not at all how this game has been designed. And we know this because the game is set up to allow us to build creatures at whatever power level we wish. Default kobolds from the MM are CR 1/8... but any DM out there can just build a kobold using the PC rules and thus throw out an 18th level Fighter kobold against the party if they want. So the party had a certain difficulty against kobolds at the beginning on the campaign, and had the same difficulty against some kobolds three years and 15 levels later. Or you have twelve different types of zombie, each of them at a different CR and the party will face those zombies over and over again, all of them always seeming to be a challenge. So we can't say there is or should be an expectation of monster power level depending on PC level. That just doesn't happen. Players can and will run up against all manner of power level for every single creature out there. Thus to my mind... the fact that this particular naga does not get weaker against the party [I]across the board[/I] (but rather only in certain ways) is nothing that seems wrong. Facing off against a monster that gains or loses differing levels of power in their abilities depending on which part of the monster's features we are talking about seems completely normal. [/QUOTE]
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2024 needs to end 2014's passive aggressive efforts to remove magic items & other elements from d&d
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