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<blockquote data-quote="Mal Malenkirk" data-source="post: 4657981" data-attributes="member: 834">Well, I basically just follow the official guideline:Superior Cover, Superior Concealment or no LOS are required to make a stealth check.&nbsp; I think I have always respected these criteria.&nbsp; If I made a mistake, my bad.On some map, it was easier than on others.On the first map, the sniper dwarf firing through the tiny window could try almost at will.&nbsp; People out of the forest, though, had fewer options.On the bridge, it was almost impossible to become hidden without magic. Indeed, not one stealth check was made on that map.On the last map, the pillars and the panel in the corridor made it a snap.&nbsp; Loads of check were made on that map.I use common sense too; I wouldn't allow Mirage to use his cloak of distortion to initiate stealth!&nbsp; Blur style effect make you hard to target but there is no question that people easily spot your location.That's true.&nbsp; But if you ask out of concern for a melee rogue vs a ranged one, I can tell you a 6th level melee rogue would have been able to sneak attack almost every round, often without flanking.&nbsp; I built one for fun and he was guaranteed 2 or 3 round of sneak attack every fight without flanking thanks to his utility powers and 1 or 2 more thanks to melee attack if they hit (still without flanking).&nbsp; And then he could still flank.&nbsp; It's really the stealth rogue who needs a bit of help.&nbsp; The current rules are more restrictive than the early one (back then, any cover could be used and some argued they could use their ally for cover!).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Mal Malenkirk, post: 4657981, member: 834"] Well, I basically just follow the official guideline: Superior Cover, Superior Concealment or no LOS are required to make a stealth check. I [I]think[/I] I have always respected these criteria. If I made a mistake, my bad. On some map, it was easier than on others. On the first map, the sniper dwarf firing through the tiny window could try almost at will. People out of the forest, though, had fewer options. On the bridge, it was almost impossible to become hidden without magic. Indeed, not one stealth check was made on that map. On the last map, the pillars and the panel in the corridor made it a snap. Loads of check were made on that map. I use common sense too; I wouldn't allow Mirage to use his cloak of distortion to initiate stealth! Blur style effect make you hard to target but there is no question that people easily spot your location. That's true. But if you ask out of concern for a melee rogue vs a ranged one, I can tell you a 6th level melee rogue would have been able to sneak attack almost every round, often without flanking. I built one for fun and he was guaranteed 2 or 3 round of sneak attack every fight without flanking thanks to his utility powers and 1 or 2 more thanks to melee attack if they hit (still without flanking). And [I]then[/I] he could still flank. It's really the stealth rogue who needs a bit of help. The current rules are more restrictive than the early one (back then, any cover could be used and some argued they could use their ally for cover!). [/QUOTE]

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