2nd to 3rd dragon conversion! Holy Hot Plate Batman!

[Leopold]

I am doing a conversion from the 2nd edition uber module Night below. I am at the part where the pc's meet up with a nice old green dragon. I used pcgen to build her in 3rd edition using random stats provided and just slowly building her up with 1 level of sorcerer, picking feats and skills, etc. Here is what i came up with.

2nd edition:

Inzeldrin, Old Green Dragon: AC -4; MV 9, fly 30
(C), swim 9; HD 17; hp 77; THACO 3; #AT 3 or 1;
Dmg ld8+8/ld8+8/2d10+8 (claw/claw/bite) or
16d6+8 (breath weapon); SA breathe cloud of poisonous
chlorine gas (50’ long by 40’ wide and 30’
high), spells, fear aura (90’ radius); SD immune to
all gases, detect invisible and hidden creatures
(80’), clairaudience within 160’ of lair, spells; MR
30%; SZ G (SO’ long plus 72’ tail); ML champion
(16); Int very (12); AL LE; XP 16,000. Special abilities
water breathing (at will), suggestion (once per
day), warp wood (thrice per day), plant growth (once
per day). Spells (cast as if 14th level): invisibility,
protection from normal missiles, magic missiles, shield;
speak with animals.


3rd edition conversion:
Inzeldrin, M Old Green Dragon Dragon, Green26 Sorcerer1 CR 18; Size:H Type GnDragon|DRAGON; HD (26d12)+(1d4)+216; hp 420; Init -1 (-1 Dex, +0 Misc); Spd Walk 40', Fly 150', Swim 40'; AC 32 (flatfooted 34, touch 32), Bite (Natural/Primary) +35 0'/BPS (2d8+11 20/x2 Neither H ) or Claw (Natural/Secondary) +30/+30 0'/PS (2d6+5 20/x2 Neither H ) or Wing (Natural/Secondary) +30/+30 0'/B (1d8+5 20/x2 Neither H ) or Slap (Natural/Secondary) +30 0'/B (2d6+5 20/x2 Neither H ) or Crush (Natural/Secondary) +30 0'/B (2d8+5 20/x2 Neither H ) or ; SA: Darkvision (800')(Ex),Water Breathing(Ex),Acid Immunity(Ex),Keen Senses(Ex),Blindsight (240')(Ex),Corrosive Gas DC 29,Cone of Corrosive Gas 16d6 Acid,Breath Weapon(Su) 50 ft Cone of Corrosive Gas,Bonus Caster Level for Sorcerer,Frightful Presence 240'(Ex),Frightful Presence DC 28,Suggestion(Sp) 3/day,Plant Growth(Sp) 1/day,Summon Familiar,Sleep Immunity(Ex),Paralysis Immunity(Ex); Vision: Keen_Lowlight, Blindsight, Darkvision AL: LE; Sv: Fort +23, Ref +14, Will +23; Str 32, Dex 9, Con 26, Int 13, Wis 22, Cha 20

Skills and Feats: Alchemy +6, Appraise +6, Bluff +31, Concentration +28, Heal +8, Intimidate +22, Knowledge (Arcana) +37, Knowledge (Nature) +6, Listen +18, Sense Motive +13, Spellcraft +27, Spot +28; Alertness,Flyby Attack,Hover,Quicken Spell-Like Ability,Scribe Scroll,Simple Weapon Proficiency,Snatch,Wingover
Possessions: 1.0 Bite (Natural/Primary), 1.0 Claw (Natural/Secondary), 1.0 Wing (Natural/Secondary), 1.0 Slap (Natural/Secondary), 1.0 Crush (Natural/Secondary),
Spells: Sorcerer: (6 /8 /7 /7 /6 /4 ) 0-Arcane Mark, Daze, Detect Magic, Detect Poison, Disrupt Undead, Light, Mage Hand, Open/Close, Read Magic 1-Cause Fear, Charm Person, Comprehend Languages, Feather Fall, Identify 2-Bull's Strength, Fog Cloud, Invisibility, Protection from Arrows 3-Lightning Bolt, Magic Circle against Good, Suggestion 4-Confusion, Ice Storm 5-Cloudkill



I was shocked when I saw the difference. From 77 hp's to over 400+. Damage for the attacks up by a monsterous amount. Breath weapons still does the same (16d6) but get into hand with her and you are deader than a doornail! Overall I knew that 3rd edition dragons were really really powerful but seeing it go from 2nd to 3rd just showed me how bad they really were...

 

[Plane Sailing]

It also demonstrates the relative fall in power of the wizard standby, Fireball. Back in 2e a 10th level wizard could kill that dragon with a couple of fireballs. Now in 3rd edition it would take him all day!

The vastly increased number of hit points for creatures is countered for fighters and rogues by their special attack abilities, but poor old wizards just aren't the engines of destruction they used to be

Nitpick: I don't know whether this is a PCGen problem or introduced elsewhere, but the 3e version shows AC as 32, 34 if flat footed. The FF AC should never be higher than non-flatfooted - dex penalties still apply when FF even though dex bonuses do not (although with a 9 dex that should only make a difference of 1 point, not 2.) You might like to check this up.

Cheers,
Alex

 

[Leopold]

It also demonstrates the relative fall in power of the wizard standby, Fireball. Back in 2e a 10th level wizard could kill that dragon with a couple of fireballs. Now in 3rd edition it would take him all day!

The vastly increased number of hit points for creatures is countered for fighters and rogues by their special attack abilities, but poor old wizards just aren't the engines of destruction they used to be

Nitpick: I don't know whether this is a PCGen problem or introduced elsewhere, but the 3e version shows AC as 32, 34 if flat footed. The FF AC should never be higher than non-flatfooted - dex penalties still apply when FF even though dex bonuses do not (although with a 9 dex that should only make a difference of 1 point, not 2.) You might like to check this up.

Cheers,
Alex

Your gonna need more than just fireballs to kill dragons anymore, which is the way it should be. Dragons are meant to be feared and respected. Not some average creature which a bunch of PC's can come along and stomp on at a whim and think nothing of it. The sheer magnitude and aura of a dragon should make any PC worth his salt consider packing some extra heat no matter what level they are to deal with any dragon big or small. I am all for the B.A.D.D society as they have a good point. The 2nd Edition dragons were utter wimps with Dragonlance being the worst possible setting for them (full grown dragons the size of greyhound buses?!?!?!).


I sent the report into the PCGen team to take a look at the dragon files. Thanks for the notice. I presume there was an error when exporting the file and the numbers might be reversed. But it can't hurt to check though!