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Message: <blockquote data-quote="StreamOfTheSky" data-source="post: 5346956" data-attributes="member: 35909">Give 'em the duskblade class chasis, then maybe.  Otherwise...you REALLY don't understand what casters can and can't do, huh?I recall when I was looking to balance things, I nerfed druid and cleric classes, such as dropping them to a d6 HD (bard and rogue went to d8).  A friend of mine whose favorite class was cleric complained, "How come you didn't nerf wizards?!"  To which I replied...what can really be nerfed?  They already get the absolute worst BAB, HD, skill points, and arguably saves (in the sense that one good save is the worst a PC class gets; I'd still take Will over the Rogue's Reflex save given a choice).  Really, what's left to take away?  I told him nerfing abusive spells on a case by case basis was the more practical way to nerf arcanists (not that I don't do the same for divine casters when needed).  Anyway, back to what I was saying...A sorc or wizard needs buff spells to fight.  The class chasis itself is godawful horrible.  But a lot of complaints involved Wizards turning into War Trolls and outfighting the fighter, and your solution to making blast spells literally UNPLAYABLE is to have the casters recourse themselves to using the spells thatp eople actually consider overpowered?  Or do you expect them to spend all 20 levels firing a crossbow for 1d8 damage like that's at all useful?  In either case, WTF?</blockquote>