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<blockquote data-quote="StreamOfTheSky" data-source="post: 5387183" data-attributes="member: 35909">Optimization isn't it so much (as long as the party as a whole is rughly optimized to the same level, DM&nbsp; can always just make the monsters tougher, issue's when one guy needs CR 14s to be challenged and everyone else can barely survive a CR 12, for example), it's just the sheer complexity.&nbsp; As you go up in level and cheap buff items and low level utility spell slots becomes plentiful, all the little things you have to keep track of just balloon out to frequently unmanageable levels, leading towards people's turns taking very long to resolve and the game dragging.As for why not publish for levels &quot;y + 1&quot; and up?&nbsp; Because maybe some people WANT those power levels.&nbsp; I haven't played much high level D&amp;D admittedly, but I like that the rules for it are right there and would like to experiment with it (cautiously) more in the future.&nbsp; If i was playing 4E and wanted that higher echelon...I'd be coming up with it myself, rather than just reviewing and nerfing/banning unbalanced rules that already exist.&nbsp; I'd rather have rules for something&nbsp; that are flawed than have to work from scratch, I'm paying for a rulebook, afterall.&nbsp; And you could apply that sentence to pretty much anything 4E doesn't cover (at least in core, didn't they not even provide hardness values for objects?) or the myriad &quot;rules&quot; of &quot;follow the DCs on DMG page 42.&quot;</blockquote>

[QUOTE="StreamOfTheSky, post: 5387183, member: 35909"] Optimization isn't it so much (as long as the party as a whole is rughly optimized to the same level, DM can always just make the monsters tougher, issue's when one guy needs CR 14s to be challenged and everyone else can barely survive a CR 12, for example), it's just the sheer complexity. As you go up in level and cheap buff items and low level utility spell slots becomes plentiful, all the little things you have to keep track of just balloon out to frequently unmanageable levels, leading towards people's turns taking very long to resolve and the game dragging. As for why not publish for levels "y + 1" and up? Because maybe some people WANT those power levels. I haven't played much high level D&D admittedly, but I like that the rules for it are right there and would like to experiment with it (cautiously) more in the future. If i was playing 4E and wanted that higher echelon...I'd be coming up with it myself, rather than just reviewing and nerfing/banning unbalanced rules that already exist. I'd rather have rules for something that are flawed than have to work from scratch, I'm paying for a [b]rule[/b]book, afterall. And you could apply that sentence to pretty much anything 4E doesn't cover (at least in core, didn't they not even provide hardness values for objects?) or the myriad "rules" of "follow the DCs on DMG page 42." [/QUOTE]

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