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3.5 E, older D&D and Pathfinder. What do D&D vets think of pathfinder
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<blockquote data-quote="grufflehead" data-source="post: 5202648" data-attributes="member: 35977"><p>The following is written from the perspective of someone who has played every edition of D&D apart from the very original box, who was happy to support Paizo by buying the Pathfinder Core Rules (and will buy the APG when it comes out) and for whom it is still likely to be the go to system for games.</p><p></p><p>Here's a suggestion for keeping the rogue 'viable' (never has a word so misappropriately applied made my blood boil like this one is beginning to accomplish): how about instead of lazy game design, quick fixes and pandering to the lowest common denominator, people actually try to write an adventure outside the model of 'spend a little bit of time making a couple of skill checks which are increasingly subverted by magic at higher level > get hit over the head with plot device > have a fight! > repeat until bored'? So, you know, the rogue player actually gets a chance to shine doing roguish stuff rather than being a poor-man's fighter who just happens to get a lot of skill points?</p><p></p><p>Please, for god's sake, let's not turn this place into the Paizo boards, which seem to be a watered down version of the Wizards' boards - the place is lousy with talk about 'builds', optimal choices, sh*tty WoW knock-off terminlogy like 'DPR' and pet names for classes. If you haven't realised it yet, Pathfinder, like its daddy, and its daddy before it, is <u>not </u>a balanced system - just like *gasp* 'rogue' <> 'fighter' so you can take your whining about how the rogue can't do as much damage as the other melee classes somewhere else. Spellcasters have always been able to do stuff that people who hit things with bits of metal *never* could. Saying that the rogue has been nerfed (see? I can use stupid terms too!) because he can't deal with undead while the wizard casually throws around disintegrates and the like is a false argument and a total waste of time. </p><p></p><p>It's designed to be a team game, which fosters cooperation, problem solving, builds confidence through taking on of personas and roles. As a mechanical exercise, it's about as balanced as a game of Monopoly where 1 player plays by the normal rules, 1 plays by the same rules but isn't allowed to buy property whose name begins with an 'S', and the other 2 start the game normally, then once they've played a few turns 1 gets a free hotel every turn and the other gets a wad of extra cash. If 'balance' is the way you judge the merit of your game system, go and find another one - it's not like there's a dearth of choice out there - because Pathfinder isn't, and never will be, it.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="grufflehead, post: 5202648, member: 35977"] The following is written from the perspective of someone who has played every edition of D&D apart from the very original box, who was happy to support Paizo by buying the Pathfinder Core Rules (and will buy the APG when it comes out) and for whom it is still likely to be the go to system for games. Here's a suggestion for keeping the rogue 'viable' (never has a word so misappropriately applied made my blood boil like this one is beginning to accomplish): how about instead of lazy game design, quick fixes and pandering to the lowest common denominator, people actually try to write an adventure outside the model of 'spend a little bit of time making a couple of skill checks which are increasingly subverted by magic at higher level > get hit over the head with plot device > have a fight! > repeat until bored'? So, you know, the rogue player actually gets a chance to shine doing roguish stuff rather than being a poor-man's fighter who just happens to get a lot of skill points? Please, for god's sake, let's not turn this place into the Paizo boards, which seem to be a watered down version of the Wizards' boards - the place is lousy with talk about 'builds', optimal choices, sh*tty WoW knock-off terminlogy like 'DPR' and pet names for classes. If you haven't realised it yet, Pathfinder, like its daddy, and its daddy before it, is [U]not [/U]a balanced system - just like *gasp* 'rogue' <> 'fighter' so you can take your whining about how the rogue can't do as much damage as the other melee classes somewhere else. Spellcasters have always been able to do stuff that people who hit things with bits of metal *never* could. Saying that the rogue has been nerfed (see? I can use stupid terms too!) because he can't deal with undead while the wizard casually throws around disintegrates and the like is a false argument and a total waste of time. It's designed to be a team game, which fosters cooperation, problem solving, builds confidence through taking on of personas and roles. As a mechanical exercise, it's about as balanced as a game of Monopoly where 1 player plays by the normal rules, 1 plays by the same rules but isn't allowed to buy property whose name begins with an 'S', and the other 2 start the game normally, then once they've played a few turns 1 gets a free hotel every turn and the other gets a wad of extra cash. If 'balance' is the way you judge the merit of your game system, go and find another one - it's not like there's a dearth of choice out there - because Pathfinder isn't, and never will be, it. [/QUOTE]
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