NOW LIVE! Today's the day you meet your new best friend. You don’t have to leave Wolfy behind... In 'Pets & Sidekicks' your companions level up with you!

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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Zimbel" data-source="post: 2655936" data-attributes="member: 29912">Comparison: Bar4/For10 vs Bar 14In theory, this should be the levels when the forsaker is strongest in comparison to a traditional class; after this level, the Forsaker will no longer gain anything additional in exchange for the loss of magic, whereas the straight Barbarian will continue to gain items.Class Barbarian 14 (rage) HP 124 (166) AC 28 (26) Init 2 Speed 40 Greataxe +23/+18/+13 (+25/+20/+15) Average Damage (including crits) 19.80 (24.6) Comp l-bow +19/+14/+9 Damage (average, including crits) 12.65    Fort +14 (+17) Ref +9 Will +8 (+11) Climb 17 (20) Jump 30 (33) Listen 18    Survival 18    Str 19 (25) Dex    14 Con 14 (20) Int 10 Wis 12 Cha 8    SAB:    Greater rage 4/day Imp. Uncanny Dodge Trap sense 4 DR 3    Indomitable Will    Feats:    WF: Greataxe Dodge Track Blind-Fight Imp. Crit: Greataxe    Equip    +5 breastplate    +4 greataxe +3 mighty (+4) comp longbow    Amulet of natural armor +3 Ring of protection +3, Boots of striding and springing, Gauntlets of Ogre Power, Cloak of Protection +3    Class    LV4 Barbarian/10 Forsaken (Rage) HP 124 (152) AC 19 (17) Init 2 Speed 30 Greataxe    +24/+19/+14 (+26/+21/+16) Damage (average, with crit) 22.20 (25.8) Comp l-bow +17/+12/+7 Damage (average, with crit) 9.35 Fort +15 (+17) Ref    +8 Will +11 (+13) Climb    22 (24) Jump 22 (24) Listen 18 Survival 18 Str 27 (31) Dex 14 Con 14 (18) Int 10 Wis 12 Cha 8    SAB:    Rage 2/day Uncanny Dodge Trap sense    1 DR    11 Slippery Mind Fast Healing 3 (50) SR 20    Feats:    Pre-reqs, same Axe feats.Equip    MW breastplate    MW mighty (+4) comp l-bow MW silver greataxe MW adamantite greataxe MW Cold Iron Greataxe    Large Advantages: AC -> Barbarian. Ranged Damage -> Barbarian. DR -> Forsaker. Will save -> Forsaker. SR -> Forsaker(Assumptions for 3.5 conversion: DR is of type "-". Can defeat Magic at LV 1, An opposed alignment (choice) at LV 5, and epic at LV 10.)And some simulated combats; I appologize about the format- this is abbreviated from a fairly detailed spreadsheet. The creatures are not using optimal tactics, but they are the same (in other words, the Nightwing combat is a simulation of 1 Nightwing vs. 1 For10/Bar 4 AND a simulation of 1 Nightwing vs 1 Bar 14, with the Nightwing using the same tactics in each case.Note that these are mean combat cases. Effects which are (or are effectively) death effects are treated as max HP damage * the probability of success.    Nightwing    HP 144 Init 8 AC 31 Full 19 Damage (Average, with crits) 26.4, 26.4 Sp    Drain    Reach    10    Spells    Y DR    15, silver & magic CR    14    End of Round5    Barbarian's damage to creature:    85.97% of creature's HPCreature's damage to Barbarian:    94.62% of Barbarian's HPForsaker's damage to creature: 83.26% of creature's HPCreature's damage to Forsaker: 93.546% of Forsaker's HP        In this encounter (1 Bar or For vs 1 Nightwing), the Barbarian takes a bit more damage, and the Barbarian hurts the creature a bit more (why? because against a flyer, ranged attacks are more significant). Either character will die on round 6, with the creature not dead.    Umber hulk, truly horrid (Not OGL- stats redacted)End of Round4:    Barbarian's damage to creature: 81.09% of creature's HPCreature's damage to Barbarian:    147.94% of Barbarian's HPForsaker's damage to creature: 85.04% of creature's HPCreature's damage to Forsaker: 95.63% of Forsaker's HPIn this combat, the creature kills the barbarian in round 3 (confusion is a large component against the barbarian, but not for the forsaker, with both a higher Will save and Slippery mind). Against the Forsaker, the creature dies in round 5, with the Forsaker having roughly 5 HP left.8 Mohrg    HP    728    (Total) Init    9 AC    23 Full    16 (w/flank) 29/23    (depends on PC) Damage (average, including crit) 11.025 + Para    Sp Reach 5 Spells N DR    - CR 8    Round4, end:    Barbarian's damage to creatures: 29.29% of creature's HPCreature's damage to Barbarian:    169.76% of Barbarian's HPForsaker's damage to creature: 30.71% of creature's HPCreature's damage to Forsaker: 104.94% of Forsaker's HPIn this combat, either kills off 1 mohrg in round 2. The barbarian dies in round 3. The Forsaker dies in round 4. The sheer number of Paralyzation saves (off of touch attacks!) here kills either off; the forsaker's living longer is an artifact of paralyzation my using paralyzation as full HP damage in lthis simulation- the Forsaker's higher DR saves him from damage, but paralyzation is actually at the same point for each.From this analysis, my conclusion is that a forsaker is very slightly stronger than a barbarian at LV 14. Unfortuantely, the bulk of a character's wealth (80.26% of that at LV 20) is gained at later levels. The forsaker's power will sink like a rock in coparision in roughly 2-3 levels.</blockquote>

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