Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Olgar Shiverstone" data-source="post: 1013001" data-attributes="member: 5868">No, the logic is that the FoB isn't an attack -- it's an extraordinary special ability, and hence it replaces a full attack (unlike Speed or Haste, which adds an attack to a full attack).&nbsp; Essentially, a FoB and a full attack are two different, non-compatible actions (which happen to look a lot alike).&nbsp; Like I said, the logic is a little weak..Stronger reasoning is this: TWF doesn't give you an extra attack (look at the &quot;Benefit&quot; portion of the feat, not the flavor text): all it does is reduce the penalties for the off hand for making a second attack.&nbsp; Anyone can fight with two weapons -- TWF just makes it easier to do.&nbsp; The monk doesn't suffer any off-hand penalties to a Flurry of Blows; hence TWF has no effect on it (she's Flurrying, not TWF).&nbsp; That still leaves the door open for ITWF, though -- one could fall back on the argument in the paragraph above, that they're different actions.Edit: I see others beat me to the second argument.Another way to look at it is this:&nbsp; Anyone can fight with two weapons in a full attack action.&nbsp; So if the TWF feat applies to FoB, can a monk without FoB make three attacks in a round, using normal two weapon fighting off-hand penalties?&nbsp; But wait!&nbsp; A monk doesn't suffer off-hand penalties when fighting unarmed!&nbsp; Therefore a monk always gets one more attack with Flurry of Blows than the table says, at the FoB -2 penalty: it's her normal off-hand attack, but without the off-hand penalties she doesn't suffer!&nbsp; Silly monks -- they should flurry at -2/-2/-2!&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f644.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":rolleyes:" title="Roll eyes&nbsp; &nbsp; :rolleyes:"&nbsp; data-smilie="11"data-shortname=":rolleyes:" /></blockquote>

[QUOTE="Olgar Shiverstone, post: 1013001, member: 5868"] No, the logic is that the FoB isn't an attack -- it's an extraordinary special ability, and hence it replaces a full attack (unlike Speed or Haste, which adds an attack to a full attack). Essentially, a FoB and a full attack are two different, non-compatible actions (which happen to look a lot alike). Like I said, the logic is a little weak.. Stronger reasoning is this: TWF doesn't give you an extra attack (look at the "Benefit" portion of the feat, not the flavor text): all it does is reduce the penalties for the off hand for making a second attack. Anyone can fight with two weapons -- TWF just makes it easier to do. The monk doesn't suffer any off-hand penalties to a Flurry of Blows; hence TWF has no effect on it (she's Flurrying, not TWF). That still leaves the door open for ITWF, though -- one could fall back on the argument in the paragraph above, that they're different actions. Edit: I see others beat me to the second argument. Another way to look at it is this: Anyone can fight with two weapons in a full attack action. So if the TWF feat applies to FoB, can a monk without FoB make three attacks in a round, using normal two weapon fighting off-hand penalties? But wait! A monk doesn't suffer off-hand penalties when fighting unarmed! Therefore a monk always gets one more attack with Flurry of Blows than the table says, at the FoB -2 penalty: it's her normal off-hand attack, but without the off-hand penalties she doesn't suffer! Silly monks -- they should flurry at -2/-2/-2! :rolleyes: [/QUOTE]

Verification