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Message: <blockquote data-quote="end of the world" data-source="post: 5705198" data-attributes="member: 6673105">enlarge person only works for  people.  it doesn't work for ravens.  i'm only going by the spells in the player's handbook, but i couldn't find any spells that would enlarge animals.  you are taking for granted that the rules for stepping away from the familiar supercede the effects of permanency.i would be on board with what you're saying if i had gotten us both enlarged through a shared spell, and then made it permanent through a second shared spell.  then the permanency spell would be forfeited if i moved away.  but what i'm talking about only involves the enlarge spell being shared.  the permanency spell would not be shared, and so i don't think it would be affected.this almost seems to imply that you have another way in mind.  if so, i'd like to hear it.thank you.  that's very nice of you.i'm prepared for that.  i'm planning to take ranks in 'ride' specific to this particular mount.  being an unconventional mount, i'll let the DM decide how many ranks he thinks i need before i'm adequately able to ride it.it doesn't seem like that much of a gray area to me.  the bit about sharing spells with your familiar explicitly states "a master and his familiar can share spells even if the spells normally do not affect creatures of the familiar's type (magical beast)."i put a lot of thought into this one, and at one point thought i might have to take a hawk instead for it to work.  but then i started looking deeper into the math, and i think i'm okay.  the reduce person spell says that the target's weight is divided by 8.  my starting weight is 31 pounds.  reducing me will put me down to about 4 pounds.  a light load for a creature with a strength of 3 is 10 pounds or less.  so even with some sort of custom made saddle, i should hardly be a burden on it.i was also looking at it from this point of view.  the description of the raven in the monster manual says it's two feet long.  enlarging it would put it at four feet long.  that's a hell of a bird.  birds that big out in the real world have been known to carry off small dogs and the like, haven't they?   that's something i hadn't considered... and something i won't be reminding the DM of.  my poor bird.  just imagine it flying with me on it's back, and then shrinking down to normal size.  yikes!he's my familiar.  i'm pretty sure he'll be cool with it.well the whole reason i'm starting at level 1 is because my former character just died.  i'm starting a new one from scratch, and joining the party of much higher level guys who didn't die.  i guess that's a pretty unorthodox way to play, but we don't take it super seriously.  it's just a cheap way for five boring married guys to get drunk cheaply on a friday night.oh hey... there was a point here...  one of the higher level guys who didn't die is a sorcerer.  i'm hoping i can get him to add permanency to his repertoire or spells and help a brotha out.  as for the hit he would have to take in his xp... well he's a pretty nice guy.  i'm hoping he'll just take that bullet for me.  if not, we've got a pretty good bit of money in the party pool, i think.  i'm still going to go through an entire level of rogue before any of this happens.  we'll come up with something.  i wouldn't be dispelling it.  i'd just be waiting for the duration to run out for me while someone casts permanency on the raven.i think the share spells thing i quoted above pretty well takes care of those concerns.good call.  i hadn't thought about that.  i think this is going to happen.  that's pretty cool.  thanks for the input everyone.</blockquote>

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