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3e, DMs, and Inferred Player Power
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<blockquote data-quote="Raven Crowking" data-source="post: 2570133" data-attributes="member: 18280"><p>Well, most 6th level characters in my campaign cannot easily afford 1,000 gp. Moreover, with 1/2 XP, there are fewer 6th level characters around. Finally, if I follow your reasoning, they should just make their own far cheaper.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Really? So the RAW do not suggest that ethereal filchers are attracted to magic? The RAW state that fire elementals cannot pass to the material plane through permanent magical fires? The RAW suggest that there is no chance of an item being cursed due to flawed workmanship? </p><p></p><p>Or are you suggesting that you are changing the RAW when you extrapolate from them? Is there anything in the RAW that suggests such things do <em><strong>not</strong></em> happen?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It would also be fairly easy to create some illusions, convince someone to touch them (<em>charm person</em>, perhaps), and when they realize that it is perfectly safe offload those <em>scarabs of death</em> on them. I'm thinking word would spread fairly quickly when the first fire elemental popped out of some poor peasant's everburning torch and burned the village down.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And the gold, no doubt, comes from the Elemental Plane of Gold. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue :p" data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" /> </p><p></p><p>Seriously, if there is a finite amount of Substance X available, logic dictates that there is a maximum amount of said substance to go around. Not so, according to the RAW. According to the RAW, <em><strong>the amount of wealth available in the game world is directly proportionate to the level of characters in the game world</strong></em>. Even the population/gp available chart in the DMG is tied to the idea that characters of certain levels will be available in any given burg based on its size.</p><p></p><p>Talk about voodoo economics! That's just plain silly!</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>What about all those high-level commoners in the RAW?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Likewise, PCs are the rare exception to the rule re: item creation feats. If you are going to claim that the PCs are "rare exceptions" when it otherwise shows up the logical problems of the RAW, then surely you concede that the same applies to any other logical consistencies that might crop up due to the "obvious" abilities of NPCs.</p><p></p><p>If PCs can reach 10th level in one game year of play, and 20th level within 5 game years, then surely NPCs can do at least a tenth as good as this? That still leaves a lot of really high-level characters, especially among the longer-lived races. And when, as in Greyhawk, we are talking aeons of game history, why haven't they wiped out the lower-CR threats by now? Wouldn't common, reliable magic make larger predators a thing of the past? This would be similar to the disappearance of wolves or lions as a major problem in Europe.</p><p></p><p>My point is not that you cannot deal with these problems. My point is that the RAW bring up larger, more glaring, and sillier inconsistencies than a low-magic world does. Pointing out that you can "hand-wave" these problems away does not make them any less real.</p><p></p><p></p><p>RC</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Raven Crowking, post: 2570133, member: 18280"] Well, most 6th level characters in my campaign cannot easily afford 1,000 gp. Moreover, with 1/2 XP, there are fewer 6th level characters around. Finally, if I follow your reasoning, they should just make their own far cheaper. Really? So the RAW do not suggest that ethereal filchers are attracted to magic? The RAW state that fire elementals cannot pass to the material plane through permanent magical fires? The RAW suggest that there is no chance of an item being cursed due to flawed workmanship? Or are you suggesting that you are changing the RAW when you extrapolate from them? Is there anything in the RAW that suggests such things do [I][B]not[/B][/I] happen? It would also be fairly easy to create some illusions, convince someone to touch them ([I]charm person[/I], perhaps), and when they realize that it is perfectly safe offload those [I]scarabs of death[/I] on them. I'm thinking word would spread fairly quickly when the first fire elemental popped out of some poor peasant's everburning torch and burned the village down. And the gold, no doubt, comes from the Elemental Plane of Gold. :p Seriously, if there is a finite amount of Substance X available, logic dictates that there is a maximum amount of said substance to go around. Not so, according to the RAW. According to the RAW, [I][B]the amount of wealth available in the game world is directly proportionate to the level of characters in the game world[/B][/I]. Even the population/gp available chart in the DMG is tied to the idea that characters of certain levels will be available in any given burg based on its size. Talk about voodoo economics! That's just plain silly! What about all those high-level commoners in the RAW? Likewise, PCs are the rare exception to the rule re: item creation feats. If you are going to claim that the PCs are "rare exceptions" when it otherwise shows up the logical problems of the RAW, then surely you concede that the same applies to any other logical consistencies that might crop up due to the "obvious" abilities of NPCs. If PCs can reach 10th level in one game year of play, and 20th level within 5 game years, then surely NPCs can do at least a tenth as good as this? That still leaves a lot of really high-level characters, especially among the longer-lived races. And when, as in Greyhawk, we are talking aeons of game history, why haven't they wiped out the lower-CR threats by now? Wouldn't common, reliable magic make larger predators a thing of the past? This would be similar to the disappearance of wolves or lions as a major problem in Europe. My point is not that you cannot deal with these problems. My point is that the RAW bring up larger, more glaring, and sillier inconsistencies than a low-magic world does. Pointing out that you can "hand-wave" these problems away does not make them any less real. RC [/QUOTE]
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