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<blockquote data-quote="Mercule" data-source="post: 5156768" data-attributes="member: 5100">Excellent....&nbsp; I get to play devil's advocate, so to speak.&nbsp; My group has had a number of conversations along this line, so I'm going to be a bit contrary, just to make sure I really get the ideas. That's a fine argument, if you're comparing dwarves to, say, vampires.&nbsp; I have absolutely no problem with vampires or any other non-PC race doing wild stuff.If you're comparing dwarves to eladrin, that doesn't really hold water.&nbsp; Both are PC races, and a PC in an intrigue-oriented campaign could expect to occupy pretty much the same role as the Aurum Concordant (essentially a super-cool guild thief, disguised as a merchant).&nbsp; So, shouldn't a player who has a dwaven character who is a member of the Aurum be able to have a reasonable facsimile of that same power?Okay.&nbsp; This is one that really boggles my mind.&nbsp; The NPC existed before the fight and will exist afterward, if the PCs lose or the NPC runs.&nbsp; Either a power is appropriate for use once, twice, or at-will during an encounter or it isn't.&nbsp; The justification that the NPC is created just for that fight breaks the 4th wall way too much for my tastes.&nbsp; This is one of the few explanations I'm actually hostile towards.But, it does take me in the direction that I finally went, internally.&nbsp; This encounter was 2-3 levels above the PCs.&nbsp; They won, but it was a pretty tough battle that forced them to regroup afterward and take an extended rest.&nbsp; This includes the fact that the players rolled numerous 1s and I critted about five times.&nbsp; So, the encounter was mechanically fair.&nbsp; For most games, that's all that's necessary.&nbsp; The difficulty was dead on.For a roleplaying game, though, there's also a &quot;spiritually&quot; or &quot;story&quot; fair.&nbsp; By that, I mean that the PCs feel like they're part of an actually world or story and that the events happen in a predictable and consistent manner.&nbsp; Dominate kinda sucks, okay, but sometimes things suck.&nbsp; There is no way the PCs can ever replicate that ability, or even approach it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Mercule, post: 5156768, member: 5100"] Excellent.... I get to play devil's advocate, so to speak. My group has had a number of conversations along this line, so I'm going to be a bit contrary, just to make sure I really get the ideas. That's a fine argument, if you're comparing dwarves to, say, vampires. I have absolutely no problem with vampires or any other non-PC race doing wild stuff. If you're comparing dwarves to eladrin, that doesn't really hold water. Both are PC races, and a PC in an intrigue-oriented campaign could expect to occupy pretty much the same role as the Aurum Concordant (essentially a super-cool guild thief, disguised as a merchant). So, shouldn't a player who has a dwaven character who is a member of the Aurum be able to have a reasonable facsimile of that same power? Okay. This is one that really boggles my mind. The NPC existed before the fight and will exist afterward, if the PCs lose or the NPC runs. Either a power is appropriate for use once, twice, or at-will during an encounter or it isn't. The justification that the NPC is created just for that fight breaks the 4th wall way too much for my tastes. This is one of the few explanations I'm actually hostile towards. But, it does take me in the direction that I finally went, internally. This encounter was 2-3 levels above the PCs. They won, but it was a pretty tough battle that forced them to regroup afterward and take an extended rest. This includes the fact that the players rolled numerous 1s and I critted about five times. So, the encounter was [u]mechanically[/u] fair. For most games, that's all that's necessary. The difficulty was dead on. For a roleplaying game, though, there's also a "spiritually" or "story" fair. By that, I mean that the PCs feel like they're part of an actually world or story and that the events happen in a predictable and consistent manner. Dominate kinda sucks, okay, but sometimes things suck. There is no way the PCs can ever replicate that ability, or even approach it. [/QUOTE]

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