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<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 5328137" data-attributes="member: 87792">Not true.&nbsp; Fallout is measured by the dice and the stage of calling.&nbsp; Without the fiction game you'd be in a gambling game with exponential raises.&nbsp; What the fiction determines (and not always even that) is the exact nature of the fallout you take.You've missed the arrow patterns out.&nbsp; It's not fictional action -&gt; mechanical response you're describing.&nbsp; There's the player + dm in the middle every time.&nbsp; Both are coming out of the player interpretation.You're missing at the crudest level &quot;I swing at him&quot; *rolls*&nbsp; &quot;He's dead.&quot;&nbsp; No ifs, no buts, no working out what happened.&nbsp; The mechanics directly change the fluff.&nbsp; And you're also missing out &quot;This fight is on a cliff edge&quot; - a nice piece of fluff.&nbsp; No representation for that in DiTV under anything other than extraordinary circumstances.&nbsp; Although it might be brought in by the fiction.&nbsp; In 4e, that cliff is there.&nbsp; It's drawn on the battlemap.&nbsp; It's a fictional construct but it has mechanical representation.&nbsp; And any attempt to use it changes the game, mechanics and fluff both, in meaningful and well defined ways.&nbsp; (Push someone over the cliff by mechanics and that really adds to the fluff).(In Spirit of the Century, the rules aren't dissociated either.&nbsp; The aspect &quot;Serial Cliffhanger&quot; or &quot;By the skin of his fingertips&quot; could be invoked by either side if there was a cliff in the fluff.&nbsp; Despite its abstract nature, the cliff now has mechanical representation and the feedback cycle works.)</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 5328137, member: 87792"] Not true. Fallout is measured by the dice and the stage of calling. Without the fiction game you'd be in a gambling game with exponential raises. What the fiction determines (and not always even that) is the exact nature of the fallout you take. You've missed the arrow patterns out. It's not fictional action -> mechanical response you're describing. There's the player + dm in the middle every time. Both are coming out of the player interpretation. You're missing at the crudest level "I swing at him" *rolls* "He's dead." No ifs, no buts, no working out what happened. The mechanics directly change the fluff. And you're also missing out "This fight is on a cliff edge" - a nice piece of fluff. No representation for that in DiTV under anything other than extraordinary circumstances. Although it might be brought in by the fiction. In 4e, that cliff is there. It's drawn on the battlemap. It's a fictional construct but it has mechanical representation. And any attempt to use it changes the game, mechanics and fluff both, in meaningful and well defined ways. (Push someone over the cliff by mechanics and that really adds to the fluff). (In Spirit of the Century, the rules aren't dissociated either. The aspect "Serial Cliffhanger" or "By the skin of his fingertips" could be invoked by either side if there was a cliff in the fluff. Despite its abstract nature, the cliff now has mechanical representation and the feedback cycle works.) [/QUOTE]

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