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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 4223696" data-attributes="member: 22779">I'm curious, why do you think that characters are defined by their "bonuses and big numbers" moreso than any other edition?  In 1e, by about 12th level, you could take on pretty much any non-unique creature single handedly and expect to win. On a relative scale, 1e characters, particularly after Unearthed Arcana, were far and away more powerful than any other edition.  2e characters were also comparatively more powerful, although, perhaps less so because a number of creatures got a bump between editions.  A 1st level fighter, with an 18/01 str, can kill an ogre in one round (2 weapon fighting, longsword specs, gives him 2d12+10+1d8+3=45 points of damage max) at 1st level.  If anything, 3e characters were considerably weaker compared to the opponents they face.  The max damage was reduced and the hit points of the monsters were massively increased.  Also, the damage output of the monsters was greatly increased, without a very large increase in PC hit points.  Thus, combat in 3e is probably the most lethal of any edition (or certainly in the top 2) barring save or die effects.  4e seems to be giving some parity between the PC's and the monsters.  Monster damage is being reduced to prevent monsters from smoking PC's in one round, but, then again, monsters are being made a bit tougher and the PC's do less damage (mostly due to the lack of stacking effects).  So, you have more granularity in combat.  Combats last more rounds, with each round seeing less spikes in damage.  So, it's more like earlier editions where the monsters simply couldn't kill PC's in one round, while retaining 3e's tactical options in combat.I guess where I disagree with you is the idea that an ogre with a +2 was frightening.  It wasn't IMO.  The fighter types that were engaging that ogre had enough hit points to be able to take a few rounds of punishment before things got really hairy.  To me, its combining the best of both worlds.</blockquote>

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