D&D 4E 4E Designers Heavily Influenced by MMOs?

[Dalberon]

I took a moment to look at the new Wizards Site and read the articles on Design and Development (Races and Classes) and noticed a startling resemblence to the Racial Benefits and the Achievement Abilities in EQ2. I am not sure if other MMOs out there have similar aspects in their game play, but some of the abilities from the Race Devleopement thread seem almost word for word from the Racial Benefits out of Everquest 2.

I was curious if anyone else noticed. It's kind neat to think I might be sharing a server with some of the game designers out there...

 

[Hand of Evil]

Just from what has been said, I have noted how stuff that makes me want to dig out my EQ role-playing rule book.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

I took a moment to look at the new Wizards Site and read the articles on Design and Development (Races and Classes) and noticed a startling resemblence to the Racial Benefits and the Achievement Abilities in EQ2. I am not sure if other MMOs out there have similar aspects in their game play, but some of the abilities from the Race Devleopement thread seem almost word for word from the Racial Benefits out of Everquest 2.

I was curious if anyone else noticed. It's kind neat to think I might be sharing a server with some of the game designers out there...

Well, the influence certainly isn't "one-way". AAs and the like came about, seemingly, because of things like the AD&D 2E "Player's Option" books and the like, and were heavily influenced by pen and paper RPGs.

So I think it's more like RPGs influence CRPGs which influence RPGs which influence CRPGs etc. - game design progresses, and designers get more adventurous, more willing to try new ideas, in both CRPGs (including MMORPGs) and pen and paper RPGs.

I certainly don't think it's "directly inspired", though. More like influence combined with convergent evolution.

 

[Glyfair]

I certainly don't think it's "directly inspired", though. More like influence combined with convergent evolution.

However, people will see what they want to see. Just like 3.5 had complaints about how "anime" it was, even where there were no anime elements, 4E will have complaints about how "MMO" it is, even where there are no MMO elements (or the MMO elements were originally drawn from D&D or D&D-like games).

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

I certainly don't think it's "directly inspired", though. More like influence combined with convergent evolution.

I would agree with this on a game-mechanics perspective, but I'm starting to feel like the art has been HEAVILY influenced by WoW. A lot of the armor I've been seeing is WoW-esque, albeit with the shoulderpads dialed down to 5 or 6 rather than WoW's default 11.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I was curious if anyone else noticed. It's kind neat to think I might be sharing a server with some of the game designers out there...

I think at this point, you'd be excited to be sharing a server with anyone when playing EQ2.

 

[Doug McCrae]

So I think it's more like RPGs influence CRPGs which influence RPGs which influence CRPGs etc. - game design progresses, and designers get more adventurous, more willing to try new ideas, in both CRPGs (including MMORPGs) and pen and paper RPGs.

Yeah. The influence of D&D on WoW is huge. It even has gnolls and owlbears. Some of the WotC developers almost certainly play MMORPGs. It's impossible not to be influenced by the culture you immerse yourself in, subconsciously or otherwise. I thought the PHB2 classes, the knight and dragon shaman, looked very WoW-inspired.

 

[WhatGravitas]

Quite true. Look at Sean K. Reynolds blog (though he's a freelancer). And currently, I think, that is a good thing:

MMORPGs have done their homework concerning balance between roles and getting an interesting play experience. They know about the goodie hunt, when advancing levels... and so on.

Tabletop RPG can learn from it, it's design theory. They don't have to use the same paradigms, but they can certainly learn from some aspects.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Yeah. The influence of D&D on WoW is huge. It even has gnolls and owlbears.

If you watch the Blizzard DVDs, you can see the D&D books on the shelves of the high-ranking developers' offices. They've also said they have multiple D&D games in the company's conference rooms, at lunch time and after work.

They're definitely fans.

 

[TheCrazyMuffinMan]

As long as there are people and things to complain about, there will always be unfounded complaints. 4E is no different.

There's nothing wrong with being legitimately inspired by common elements in a certain genre or style, as long as they don't damage the game -on their own-.