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<blockquote data-quote="Gothmog" data-source="post: 4503349" data-attributes="member: 317">I forgot to say this in the previous post, but for me and my group, game mechanics can influence the &quot;feel&quot; of the game, but not determine it.&nbsp; The main thing that is important here is that the mechanics don't obstruct the flow of the game, or needlessly complicate it.&nbsp; Obviously, the idea of powers and healing surges are new, don't &quot;feel&quot; like 1e AD&amp;D.&nbsp; However, the net effect of those new ideas in play &quot;feels&quot; very much like 1e for me and my group, and apparently quite a few other folks here too.For me and my group, 3e needlessly complicated things, and the implied tone of the 3e rules (high magic, caster dominance, pokemounts, etc) were not in agreement with the kinds of games I enjoy running and playing.&nbsp; In addition, IMO there were too many &quot;fiddly bits&quot; in 3e, especially in character design, that actually detracted from immersion in the game (for example, &quot;building&quot; a character from levels 1-20 before play ever began).&nbsp; IME, many players fell into the optimization traps of 3e, and the game was all about maximizing bonuses and minimizing penalties.&nbsp; In and of itself, thats not a bad thing, but a lot of people took it to extremes, such that within the same group, two PCs of the same level could be of radically different power with build choices- which could cause all kinds of problems in play.&nbsp; 4e still retains feats and adds powers, but there aren't the elaborate feat trees and prereqs of 3e, so more organic character growth is again possible without penalizing the player due to suboptimal choices (meaning its harder to make a character that sucks or dominates everybody else- a VERY good thing IMO).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Gothmog, post: 4503349, member: 317"] I forgot to say this in the previous post, but for me and my group, game mechanics can influence the "feel" of the game, but not determine it. The main thing that is important here is that the mechanics don't obstruct the flow of the game, or needlessly complicate it. Obviously, the idea of powers and healing surges are new, don't "feel" like 1e AD&D. However, the net effect of those new ideas in play "feels" very much like 1e for me and my group, and apparently quite a few other folks here too. For me and my group, 3e needlessly complicated things, and the implied tone of the 3e rules (high magic, caster dominance, pokemounts, etc) were not in agreement with the kinds of games I enjoy running and playing. In addition, IMO there were too many "fiddly bits" in 3e, especially in character design, that actually detracted from immersion in the game (for example, "building" a character from levels 1-20 before play ever began). IME, many players fell into the optimization traps of 3e, and the game was all about maximizing bonuses and minimizing penalties. In and of itself, thats not a bad thing, but a lot of people took it to extremes, such that within the same group, two PCs of the same level could be of radically different power with build choices- which could cause all kinds of problems in play. 4e still retains feats and adds powers, but there aren't the elaborate feat trees and prereqs of 3e, so more organic character growth is again possible without penalizing the player due to suboptimal choices (meaning its harder to make a character that sucks or dominates everybody else- a VERY good thing IMO). [/QUOTE]

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