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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Cadfan" data-source="post: 4543720" data-attributes="member: 40961">I'd be careful not to oversell the part in bold.  I can think of one and only one method, in all of 4e, that allows one to non magically intimidate someone into losing hit points.  I mean, the power that does it is there, it exists, its real, so I guess 4e has this.  But I think that both the fans and detractors of "hit points are more abstract now" should maybe take a step back from this point, and stop letting it dominate conversation.The opposite, of course, is quite common- you can regain hit points by regaining your will to continue fighting.  But you can't lose hit points by losing your will to fight (not counting damage from magical/psychic attacks themed as attacking your will to fight), except through one particular attack power.For some reason, I'm ok with the basic system.  I think its a little silly to lose hit points because you were intimidated into surrendering.  But I think it makes decent sense to allow you to regain hit points by regaining determination.  It fits the genre- I stab you a bit, you look like you might die, but then you surge to your feet in defiance and desperately battle some more, and I have to stab you a few more times before you actually die.</blockquote>