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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
4e How Should PCs be allowed to Die (Cinematically or Like Everyone Else)?
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<blockquote data-quote="Sundragon2012" data-source="post: 3772914" data-attributes="member: 7624"><p>I don't understand the kind of sentiment that goes something like this, "I want to play a hero and heroes don't die via a mook's critical hit or a wizard's disintigration spell."</p><p></p><p>I thought that heroes in fantasy fiction and fantasy RPing for the last 30yrs has assumed that the most memorable heroes are the ones that actually survived. I am pretty sure that Aragorn and I know for certain that Conan travelled with a lot of skilled warriors and hero types but Aragorn survived and some of his friends didn't, Conan survived and many of his comrades died.</p><p></p><p>The heroes of legend are those that take the risks, can be killed via a crossbow bolt in the chest but via skill and good fortune survive long enough to develop a legendary reputation. No player is guaranteed a hero of legend. How dumb and unheroic would it be if you were a legend without actually accomplishing anything? How unheroic would it be if the two NPCs who travelled with you get their skulls creushed by a giant's club durng a couple critical hits but YOU COULDN'T DIE that way?</p><p></p><p>Heroes are folks who take MORE risks than the average person, actually sacrifice more than the average person and unfortunately often don't live as long as a normal person. Those that do become legends, those that don't become footnotes. If heroes are guaranteed survival against all threats, like critical hits, that would kill a "normal" than they they aren't heroes at all, but beings whose very nature (the rules of the game) assures survival and makes the word hero meaningless.</p><p></p><p>Now, if one likes lighter games where the good guys die less via some hero protection mechanic, DM fudging or Player Choice (?!?!?!) that's fine, just not my cup o' tea. I can however, definately get behind hero points or action points to allow a reroll or add a certain number of points to the roll based on how many points the character uses (acting as the blessing of the gods or fate perhaps...in fact I use a rule like this) but if the PC blows it, maybe by rolling a 1 again....I'm sorry but the PC has got to go. At this point my players would solemnly crumple up their character sheet and know it was time to create a new PC.</p><p></p><p>IMO it is very unfun to play a coddled character. I am a DM and I know DMs fudge from time to time...I do though rarely. However, if I know the DM is fudging or if I felt that I was in some way being guarded against death either by arbitrary game mechanics or DM fiat I would find myself disassociated from the character because I would know....it would feel like cheating.</p><p></p><p>Thankfully my players feel the same way.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Sundragon</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Sundragon2012, post: 3772914, member: 7624"] I don't understand the kind of sentiment that goes something like this, "I want to play a hero and heroes don't die via a mook's critical hit or a wizard's disintigration spell." I thought that heroes in fantasy fiction and fantasy RPing for the last 30yrs has assumed that the most memorable heroes are the ones that actually survived. I am pretty sure that Aragorn and I know for certain that Conan travelled with a lot of skilled warriors and hero types but Aragorn survived and some of his friends didn't, Conan survived and many of his comrades died. The heroes of legend are those that take the risks, can be killed via a crossbow bolt in the chest but via skill and good fortune survive long enough to develop a legendary reputation. No player is guaranteed a hero of legend. How dumb and unheroic would it be if you were a legend without actually accomplishing anything? How unheroic would it be if the two NPCs who travelled with you get their skulls creushed by a giant's club durng a couple critical hits but YOU COULDN'T DIE that way? Heroes are folks who take MORE risks than the average person, actually sacrifice more than the average person and unfortunately often don't live as long as a normal person. Those that do become legends, those that don't become footnotes. If heroes are guaranteed survival against all threats, like critical hits, that would kill a "normal" than they they aren't heroes at all, but beings whose very nature (the rules of the game) assures survival and makes the word hero meaningless. Now, if one likes lighter games where the good guys die less via some hero protection mechanic, DM fudging or Player Choice (?!?!?!) that's fine, just not my cup o' tea. I can however, definately get behind hero points or action points to allow a reroll or add a certain number of points to the roll based on how many points the character uses (acting as the blessing of the gods or fate perhaps...in fact I use a rule like this) but if the PC blows it, maybe by rolling a 1 again....I'm sorry but the PC has got to go. At this point my players would solemnly crumple up their character sheet and know it was time to create a new PC. IMO it is very unfun to play a coddled character. I am a DM and I know DMs fudge from time to time...I do though rarely. However, if I know the DM is fudging or if I felt that I was in some way being guarded against death either by arbitrary game mechanics or DM fiat I would find myself disassociated from the character because I would know....it would feel like cheating. Thankfully my players feel the same way. Sundragon [/QUOTE]
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4e How Should PCs be allowed to Die (Cinematically or Like Everyone Else)?
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