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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
4E Ruined My Love For 3.5
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<blockquote data-quote="Cadfan" data-source="post: 4187822" data-attributes="member: 40961"><p>The announcement of 4e hasn't changed my opinion of 3e one bit. It has, however, changed my expectations and wants. Before 4e was announced, I was bugged by the effect of magic at high levels, the crappiness of first and second level play, the need to plan your character meticulously in advance if you wanted to use PRCs, the 5 minute workday, the degree of complexiting in tracking multiple buff spells with varying durations for every single character in the party, the way quirks in the math made certain things that should be good instead turn out to suck, the way you HAD to have four fights a day or the game didn't work right, and so forth.</p><p></p><p>But I had years of DMing 3e under my belt, and I knew where to use workarounds, and where to just grin and bear it. So I could run a pretty darn good game.</p><p></p><p>Since the announcement of 4e, I've had less desire to use those workarounds, and less desire to grin and bear a problem in the game. Now that I know there's a game out there that solves these problems while still adhering to the underlying theme of D&D, I'd rather play it than 3e.</p><p></p><p>I have no doubt I'll feel the same way in 8 years. Each edition of D&D does a sort of "bug fix" on the previous edition, then tries some new stuff. Inevitably, in a game as complex as D&D, some of the new stuff has problems. But we'll get a one or two year period where no one has fully figured out all the problems, which will function as a sort of armistice, and then after that I'll have my workarounds again. So we'll be back to where we started, except with a more vibrant game thanks to the addition of new material, and the deletion of shabby material.</p><p></p><p>Honestly, my biggest fear is that too many shabby legacy elements will still be around. Specifically, I'm worried about crappy spells being included so that people won't freak out when their favorite (but stupid) spell isn't in the game. This is not a game that truly needs the spell Erase, for example.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Cadfan, post: 4187822, member: 40961"] The announcement of 4e hasn't changed my opinion of 3e one bit. It has, however, changed my expectations and wants. Before 4e was announced, I was bugged by the effect of magic at high levels, the crappiness of first and second level play, the need to plan your character meticulously in advance if you wanted to use PRCs, the 5 minute workday, the degree of complexiting in tracking multiple buff spells with varying durations for every single character in the party, the way quirks in the math made certain things that should be good instead turn out to suck, the way you HAD to have four fights a day or the game didn't work right, and so forth. But I had years of DMing 3e under my belt, and I knew where to use workarounds, and where to just grin and bear it. So I could run a pretty darn good game. Since the announcement of 4e, I've had less desire to use those workarounds, and less desire to grin and bear a problem in the game. Now that I know there's a game out there that solves these problems while still adhering to the underlying theme of D&D, I'd rather play it than 3e. I have no doubt I'll feel the same way in 8 years. Each edition of D&D does a sort of "bug fix" on the previous edition, then tries some new stuff. Inevitably, in a game as complex as D&D, some of the new stuff has problems. But we'll get a one or two year period where no one has fully figured out all the problems, which will function as a sort of armistice, and then after that I'll have my workarounds again. So we'll be back to where we started, except with a more vibrant game thanks to the addition of new material, and the deletion of shabby material. Honestly, my biggest fear is that too many shabby legacy elements will still be around. Specifically, I'm worried about crappy spells being included so that people won't freak out when their favorite (but stupid) spell isn't in the game. This is not a game that truly needs the spell Erase, for example. [/QUOTE]
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