Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 4130682" data-attributes="member: 4937">Yes.&nbsp; Although, the claim is true in either case.Ok, that I'll grant you.&nbsp; Let's just say that the claim is true of virtually all published RPGs.&nbsp; I had recognized the corner case, decided the technicality wasn't worth explaining and figured I could deal with it if anyone mentioned it.&nbsp; I'll do so now.Congradulations, you just created a competitive RPG.&nbsp; Last player left alive 'wins'.&nbsp; Now of course, this isn't strictly true either.&nbsp; Not being able to die isn't the same as being invincible.&nbsp; You could still be thrown in a donjon for all eternity, left tied to a rock for an eagle to pick your liver out, or whatever.&nbsp; But if you'll recall, I was earlier putting 'death' in quotation marks for exactly this reason.&nbsp; In monopoly, you don't actually die in the fluff, but being put out of the game via bankruptsy is the same mechanically as death.&nbsp; I defined 'game death' to be, any situation where you could not continue to play as that character without intervention from another player.If the last player left alive is actually immune from 'game death', then he 'wins'.&nbsp; The game is now over in a way that RPGs usually aren't.Which is how RPG's differ from Monopoly.Or in other words, you invented cooperative Monopoly.&nbsp; (I can scarsely think of anything more boring.)&nbsp; Gifting other players with loans is the mechanical equivalent of 'raise dead' (or at least 'cure critical wounds').&nbsp; Agreed.&nbsp; And I didn't say that a purely cooperative non-competitive RPG wouldn't make sense.&nbsp; I said that a purely cooperative non-competitive RPG would bore me.&nbsp; I can understand some people want to play RPGs where they can't actually die, but I'm just not one of them and don't want to see D&amp;D go in that direction.&nbsp; Quite a few narrativist games move strongly in this direction, such that the only real possibility of player death is voluntary and that's fine for those games.&nbsp; But they aren't inherently superior to the experience of D&amp;D.&nbsp; I think D&amp;D goes sour when it turns into the DM vs. the Players, but so long as everyone maintains thier good gamesmanship I love the tactical, puzzle solving, skillful play aspect of D&amp;D.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 4130682, member: 4937"] Yes. Although, the claim is true in either case. Ok, that I'll grant you. Let's just say that the claim is true of virtually all published RPGs. I had recognized the corner case, decided the technicality wasn't worth explaining and figured I could deal with it if anyone mentioned it. I'll do so now. Congradulations, you just created a competitive RPG. Last player left alive 'wins'. Now of course, this isn't strictly true either. Not being able to die isn't the same as being invincible. You could still be thrown in a donjon for all eternity, left tied to a rock for an eagle to pick your liver out, or whatever. But if you'll recall, I was earlier putting 'death' in quotation marks for exactly this reason. In monopoly, you don't actually die in the fluff, but being put out of the game via bankruptsy is the same mechanically as death. I defined 'game death' to be, any situation where you could not continue to play as that character without intervention from another player. If the last player left alive is actually immune from 'game death', then he 'wins'. The game is now over in a way that RPGs usually aren't. Which is how RPG's differ from Monopoly. Or in other words, you invented cooperative Monopoly. (I can scarsely think of anything more boring.) Gifting other players with loans is the mechanical equivalent of 'raise dead' (or at least 'cure critical wounds'). Agreed. And I didn't say that a purely cooperative non-competitive RPG wouldn't make sense. I said that a purely cooperative non-competitive RPG would bore me. I can understand some people want to play RPGs where they can't actually die, but I'm just not one of them and don't want to see D&D go in that direction. Quite a few narrativist games move strongly in this direction, such that the only real possibility of player death is voluntary and that's fine for those games. But they aren't inherently superior to the experience of D&D. I think D&D goes sour when it turns into the DM vs. the Players, but so long as everyone maintains thier good gamesmanship I love the tactical, puzzle solving, skillful play aspect of D&D. [/QUOTE]

Verification