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<blockquote data-quote="BryonD" data-source="post: 4086509" data-attributes="member: 957">Insuffcient data.&nbsp; Oh, yeah I forgot.&nbsp; 3E requires thinking. (And you don't know how much the XP reward for defeating them is either, because you don't know the circumstance bonuses or penalties).&nbsp; No, they are two different things.&nbsp; The carrot will certainly encourage the players to roleplay (as it does just as much in 3e with a decent DM) but the mechanics can support (a little) or disrupt (a lot) the process.You can easily add a rule that every time a player has to pay a cost in Monopoly that price is reduced by 10% if the player roleplays the transaction.&nbsp; Now you have a carrot and some people will roleplay for that carrot.&nbsp; But the mechanics of Monopoly still suck for roleplaying because they fail terribly at producing a plausible scenario (they suck at simulation).&nbsp; If you land on Park Place you can express outrage over the high rent and demand that you will go stay on Virginia unless a more reasonable price is offered.&nbsp; But your effort to haggle will fall flat because the rules say you stay where you land.&nbsp; Carrot is one thing and game mechanics are another.By staying out of the way.&nbsp; 3E stays out of the way.&nbsp; What has been shown of 4e gets in the way.&nbsp; Maybe that is just for me and not for you but for me it more than just a little bit.The claim that started this line of conversation was that RP rewards were a new addition in 4E.&nbsp; That is not true.&nbsp; Now it may be true that 4E tries to claim that RP rewards can now be looked up on a table.&nbsp; And if they have reduced the RP concept down to something that cut and dry, then that is just another strike against it for me.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="BryonD, post: 4086509, member: 957"] Insuffcient data. Oh, yeah I forgot. 3E requires thinking. (And you don't know how much the XP reward for defeating them is either, because you don't know the circumstance bonuses or penalties). No, they are two different things. The carrot will certainly encourage the players to roleplay (as it does just as much in 3e with a decent DM) but the mechanics can support (a little) or disrupt (a lot) the process. You can easily add a rule that every time a player has to pay a cost in Monopoly that price is reduced by 10% if the player roleplays the transaction. Now you have a carrot and some people will roleplay for that carrot. But the mechanics of Monopoly still suck for roleplaying because they fail terribly at producing a plausible scenario (they suck at simulation). If you land on Park Place you can express outrage over the high rent and demand that you will go stay on Virginia unless a more reasonable price is offered. But your effort to haggle will fall flat because the rules say you stay where you land. Carrot is one thing and game mechanics are another. By staying out of the way. 3E stays out of the way. What has been shown of 4e gets in the way. Maybe that is just for me and not for you but for me it more than just a little bit. The claim that started this line of conversation was that RP rewards were a new addition in 4E. That is not true. Now it may be true that 4E tries to claim that RP rewards can now be looked up on a table. And if they have reduced the RP concept down to something that cut and dry, then that is just another strike against it for me. [/QUOTE]

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