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<blockquote data-quote="SHARK" data-source="post: 3722267" data-attributes="member: 1131">Greetings!Indeed, I think it is important to maintain a certain threat level from lower-level characters towards whatever classes of adventurer the players are--this is somewhat addressed in 3E, as that whole problem existed in 1E/2E. Thus, I certainly hope they do not enforce some kind of across-the board mookism in favour of the &quot;heroes&quot;. It's good to hear that Star Wars Saga allows you to make better &quot;Stormtroopers&quot; in this regard. Personally, I always found it entirely frustrating and dull that the &quot;heroes&quot; in Star Wars films--yes, it's fine to be heroes--but they always slaughtered the hapless stormtroopers, to the point where the &quot;stormtroopers&quot;--the vaunted machinery of the all-conquering Empire looked consistently *INCOMPETENT*. That is not a style that I enjoy having in the D&amp;D game.As for Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay--yes, I'm quite familiar with the game. I played Warhammer for probably six years straight, and I discovered the limitations of the game system. When it comes to relatively low-level, gritty &quot;realistic&quot; fantasy--Warhammer has D&amp;D beat like a jackhammer working jello.However, and from reviewing the new edition of the Warhammer game as well, I tend to think that the same flaw in the system exists now as it existed in Warhammer from before:Namely, that the Warhammer game breaks at higher levels. There is also a diminishing point, for example, where every character at higher levels--&quot;levels&quot; being loosely used here, as Warhammer uses &quot;Careers&quot;--the characters all begin to flatten out and look virtually indistinguishable from each other after about 12-16 careers. In that regard, as well as skill resolution, the Warhammer game system essentially reaches a &quot;ceiling&quot; of sorts, where the characters have topped out, and there just isn't much more that they can do to change or improve their characters; as well as the growing towards sameness effect that I mentioned earlier, generally reaches a point where the game is broken and less fun, because there is essentially nothing more mechanically--ability wise, power wise, or skill wise, that the higher &quot;level&quot; character can do. Thus, in my view, Warhammer while certainly attractive and even quite elegant, especially at lower, gritty levels of play, has as it's salient flaw of not embracing a more open-ended power structure like Rolemaster, or D&amp;D 3E/3.5E and now 4E. A good game, but certainly a game system that has limitations.Great discussion, everyone. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> Semper Fidelis,SHARK</blockquote>

[QUOTE="SHARK, post: 3722267, member: 1131"] Greetings! Indeed, I think it is important to maintain a certain threat level from lower-level characters towards whatever classes of adventurer the players are--this is somewhat addressed in 3E, as that whole problem existed in 1E/2E. Thus, I certainly hope they do not enforce some kind of across-the board mookism in favour of the "heroes". It's good to hear that Star Wars Saga allows you to make better "Stormtroopers" in this regard. Personally, I always found it entirely frustrating and dull that the "heroes" in Star Wars films--yes, it's fine to be heroes--but they always slaughtered the hapless stormtroopers, to the point where the "stormtroopers"--the vaunted machinery of the all-conquering Empire looked consistently *INCOMPETENT*. That is not a style that I enjoy having in the D&D game. As for Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay--yes, I'm quite familiar with the game. I played Warhammer for probably six years straight, and I discovered the limitations of the game system. When it comes to relatively low-level, gritty "realistic" fantasy--Warhammer has D&D beat like a jackhammer working jello. However, and from reviewing the new edition of the Warhammer game as well, I tend to think that the same flaw in the system exists now as it existed in Warhammer from before: Namely, that the Warhammer game breaks at higher levels. There is also a diminishing point, for example, where every character at higher levels--"levels" being loosely used here, as Warhammer uses "Careers"--the characters all begin to flatten out and look virtually indistinguishable from each other after about 12-16 careers. In that regard, as well as skill resolution, the Warhammer game system essentially reaches a "ceiling" of sorts, where the characters have topped out, and there just isn't much more that they can do to change or improve their characters; as well as the growing towards sameness effect that I mentioned earlier, generally reaches a point where the game is broken and less fun, because there is essentially nothing more mechanically--ability wise, power wise, or skill wise, that the higher "level" character can do. Thus, in my view, Warhammer while certainly attractive and even quite elegant, especially at lower, gritty levels of play, has as it's salient flaw of not embracing a more open-ended power structure like Rolemaster, or D&D 3E/3.5E and now 4E. A good game, but certainly a game system that has limitations. Great discussion, everyone. :) Semper Fidelis, SHARK [/QUOTE]

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