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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ValhallaGH" data-source="post: 4545589" data-attributes="member: 41187">If all your stated assumptions were true (and it's an amazingly bizarre situation, as indicated by the number of ifs in your post) then yes, the two characters would have a similar attack bonus.  Fighters do have a class feature that gives them a +1 to attacks with either one-handed or two-handed weapons (chosen at first level).A 4E Fighter is a good fighter because he 1) can take a ton of damage, far more than any wizard, 2) has a lot of neat tricks to use that make him as good (or better) at fighting as a Wizard is at magicing, 3) is freely proficient with all simple and martial weapons, 4) can use every shield and almost every armor for free, 5) is better with his chosen type of weapons (see above) than any other class.How the @(&#$ is this character allowed to be proficient!?  Is the DM high out of his mind?  Really, where the heck was the DM oversight on this one?The Wizard in your example has devoted himself to melee combat to a degree only seen amongst fighters, rangers, paladins and barbarians.  He's not quite as devoted as those classes (different class features, which makes a huge difference in 4E) but he's still heavily invested into it.Actually, it's pretty common in everything except earlier versions of D&D.  And it does happen in most of the source literature.Most fantasy novels, especially Sword & Sorcery, have everyone using weapons, and using them skillfully.  (In fact, the exceptions I'm aware of are all based [directly or indirectly] upon D&D games.)  Different levels of talent come into play, and the guys that use them all the time are better than the guys that don't, but that's not a major issue.  By 4E logic, these are simply a difference in ability scores, and possibly proficiency.  The difference between a 12 Strength and a 16 Strength may not seem like a lot, but it is (10% bonus on attacks).Personally, I find the way 4E does things to give a greater sense of heroism to the characters.  A high level wizard can actually beat a low level fighter in a melee, allowing the guy with years of combat experience (or months of extremely intense experience) to overcome the guy with basic combat training.  This enhances my sense of enjoyment and reinforces my ability to immerse myself and enjoy the game and story.I think everyone can agree that enhancing enjoyment and immersion are good things in our hobby.</blockquote>

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