Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
4th edition, The fantastic game that everyone hated.
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="D'karr" data-source="post: 6076707" data-attributes="member: 336"><p>The reverse is also an issue, when you consider something like the Ranger's Class Feature - Favored Enemy. IMO, "player selections/decisions" should be relevant in the game. A Ranger that selects a particular "hated enemy" should have a reasonable opportunity of encountering that enemy in a campaign. However, DM choices will always trump player choices in this aspect. If a DM decides to never run an encounter with a favored enemy, the ranger player never gets to use his class feature. He "suffers" from the same issue as the rogue with the sneak attack feature in an undead campaign. The player decision is being totally cancelled by the mechanics, and the DM choices. </p><p></p><p>My issue with the "rules" at that point is that the fix is so trivial that it seems ridiculous for the general rules to be so restrictive. Somebody posed the example of Sneak Attack affecting everything, but wraiths being an exception. To me as a player, and as a DM, that is a much more workable, and desirable mechanic than the default of - all undead, constructs, and plants are immune to Sneak Attack. </p><p></p><p>I can envision that constructs, as "machines" of some sort, can still have vulnerable spots. So I can see them all still being affected by Sneak Attack, the PC is basically gumming up the cogs of the machine, but there can be exceptions. The Juggernaut, for example, might be immune or resistant to Sneak Attack. A particular golem such as an Iron Golem might be the same. I find that to be a better solution "rules-wise".</p><p></p><p>This is the same issue with the "prone" condition in 4e, which I describe more as off-balance for those creatures that would seem "immune". I can see the general rule simply describing the prone condition, and any effect that imposes that condition works similarly. Then I can have particular monsters that are immune to it. If as a DM, I don't want a Gelatinous Cube to be affected by that condition, then make it immune.</p><p></p><p>The issue is not that some class abilities should not work under certain conditions. The issue is that the game mechanics should not make player decisions irrelevant under large portions of the general rules.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="D'karr, post: 6076707, member: 336"] The reverse is also an issue, when you consider something like the Ranger's Class Feature - Favored Enemy. IMO, "player selections/decisions" should be relevant in the game. A Ranger that selects a particular "hated enemy" should have a reasonable opportunity of encountering that enemy in a campaign. However, DM choices will always trump player choices in this aspect. If a DM decides to never run an encounter with a favored enemy, the ranger player never gets to use his class feature. He "suffers" from the same issue as the rogue with the sneak attack feature in an undead campaign. The player decision is being totally cancelled by the mechanics, and the DM choices. My issue with the "rules" at that point is that the fix is so trivial that it seems ridiculous for the general rules to be so restrictive. Somebody posed the example of Sneak Attack affecting everything, but wraiths being an exception. To me as a player, and as a DM, that is a much more workable, and desirable mechanic than the default of - all undead, constructs, and plants are immune to Sneak Attack. I can envision that constructs, as "machines" of some sort, can still have vulnerable spots. So I can see them all still being affected by Sneak Attack, the PC is basically gumming up the cogs of the machine, but there can be exceptions. The Juggernaut, for example, might be immune or resistant to Sneak Attack. A particular golem such as an Iron Golem might be the same. I find that to be a better solution "rules-wise". This is the same issue with the "prone" condition in 4e, which I describe more as off-balance for those creatures that would seem "immune". I can see the general rule simply describing the prone condition, and any effect that imposes that condition works similarly. Then I can have particular monsters that are immune to it. If as a DM, I don't want a Gelatinous Cube to be affected by that condition, then make it immune. The issue is not that some class abilities should not work under certain conditions. The issue is that the game mechanics should not make player decisions irrelevant under large portions of the general rules. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
4th edition, The fantastic game that everyone hated.
Top