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5E: Fifth Edition Monster Variants Inspired by Fourth Edition Sources
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<blockquote data-quote="Cleon" data-source="post: 9240416" data-attributes="member: 57383"><p>Okay, continuing with the <strong><a href="https://www.enworld.org/posts/9230172" target="_blank">Scarlet Death</a></strong>.</p><p></p><p>I think it prudent to base it on the Third Edition version from <em>Monster Manual II</em> (2002), since that's the only official version that's explicitly undead.</p><p></p><p>Here's the original stats for our convenience:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The incorporeal traits could easily be represented in 5E by the various damage resistances and immunities of your last draft, but I'm more inclined to give it the "full incorporeal suite" of a <strong><a href="https://www.5esrd.com/gamemastering/monsters-foes/monsters-by-type/undead/wraith" target="_blank">Wraith</a></strong>:</p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px"><strong>Damage Resistances</strong> acid, cold, fire, lightning, thunder; bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing from nonmagical attacks</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><strong>Damage Immunities</strong> <span style="color: magenta">necrotic</span>, poison</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><strong>Condition Immunities</strong> <span style="color: magenta">charmed</span>, exhaustion, grappled, paralyzed, petrified, poisoned, prone, restrained</p><p></p><p>I'm inclined to make it susceptible to fear rather than immune to the frightened condition, since the original monster was a cautious combatant that "prefers to attack from ambush, and it avoids physically powerful targets that might easily break free of its grasp."</p><p></p><p>I'll consider <strong>Abilities</strong> next.</p><p></p><p>The proposals for the undead "Blood Mist" are Str 9, Dex 16, Con 16, Int 9, Wis 14, Cha 9 which are too low for my taste, especially some of the mental stats.</p><p></p><p>The early versions of the Crimson Death are super smart. They have "INTELLIGENCE: Genius (17-18)" in AD&D; in Third Edition, a Crimson Death has Str —, Dex 21, Con —, Int 17, Wis 15, Cha 14.</p><p></p><p>I think those 3E ability scores work fine in 5E, so it just needs a Strength and Constitution.</p><p></p><p>The CON 16 of the proposed 5E version is fine by me, but I'm tempted to make it CON 18 like a <strong><a href="https://www.5esrd.com/database/creature/vampire" target="_blank">Vampire</a></strong>.</p><p></p><p>That just leaves a Strength score.</p><p></p><p>The AD&D Death "possesses strength equal to a normal human. It is able to carry a passive weight equal to an adult human." That suggests STR 10 (+0) or so.</p><p></p><p>The 3E Death can "lift another creature or an object weighing up to 300 pounds" and has a +11 grapple. That means it has a +5 modifier on its grapple as its Base Attack Bonus is only +6 (due to undead having pathetic BAB in 3E). I presume they just had it use its +5 DEX modifier for grapple checks and forgot to mention it in the text. Giving the 5E version STR 20 (+5) seems WAY too high.</p><p></p><p>How about we average the "virtual" STR 21 of the 3E Crimson Death with the STR 9 of your Blood Mist and round to even, which results in STR 14 (+2).</p><p></p><p>That's enough for it to haul victims about, but isn't too overpowered.</p><p></p><p>It's worth pointing out that the 5E Carrying Rules say "You can push, drag, or lift a weight in pounds up to twice your carrying capacity (or 30 times your Strength score). While pushing or dragging weight in excess of your carrying capacity, your speed drops to 5 feet." Meaning a STR 10 (+0) Scarlet Death would be able to lift a 300 pound weight and move it around like the 3E one can, just more slowly (at speed 5 ft, so 10 feet if it dashes). A sustained 3E <em>telekinesis</em> moves objects at 20 feet per round.</p><p></p><p>Overall, I prefer the STR 10, CON 18 arrangement.</p><p></p><p>Anyhow, putting the above together would make:</p><p></p><table style='width: 100%'><tr><th><p style="text-align: center">STR</p> </th><th><p style="text-align: center">DEX</p> </th><th><p style="text-align: center">CON</p> </th><th><p style="text-align: center">INT</p> </th><th><p style="text-align: center">WIS</p> </th><th><p style="text-align: center">CHA</p> </th></tr><tr><td><span style="color: green"><p style="text-align: center">10 (+0)</p> </span></td><td><span style="color: green"><p style="text-align: center">21 (+5)</p> </span></td><td><span style="color: green"><p style="text-align: center">18 (+4)</p> </span></td><td><span style="color: green"><p style="text-align: center">17 (+3)</p> </span></td><td><span style="color: green"><p style="text-align: center">15 (+2)</p> </span></td><td><span style="color: green"><p style="text-align: center">14 (+2)</p> </span></td></tr><tr><td><span style="color: magenta"><p style="text-align: center"><em>or 14 (+2) <strong>?</strong></em></p> </span></td><td><span style="color: magenta"><p style="text-align: center"></p> </span></td><td><span style="color: magenta"><p style="text-align: center"><em>or 16 (+3) <strong>?</strong></em></p> </span></td><td><span style="color: magenta"><p style="text-align: center"></p> </span></td><td><span style="color: magenta"><p style="text-align: center"></p> </span></td><td><span style="color: magenta"><p style="text-align: center"></p> </span></td></tr></table><p></p><p>Does that look OK to you?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Cleon, post: 9240416, member: 57383"] Okay, continuing with the [B][URL='https://www.enworld.org/posts/9230172']Scarlet Death[/URL][/B]. I think it prudent to base it on the Third Edition version from [I]Monster Manual II[/I] (2002), since that's the only official version that's explicitly undead. Here's the original stats for our convenience: The incorporeal traits could easily be represented in 5E by the various damage resistances and immunities of your last draft, but I'm more inclined to give it the "full incorporeal suite" of a [b][url='https://www.5esrd.com/gamemastering/monsters-foes/monsters-by-type/undead/wraith']Wraith[/url][/b]: [indent][b]Damage Resistances[/b] acid, cold, fire, lightning, thunder; bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing from nonmagical attacks [b]Damage Immunities[/b] [color=magenta]necrotic[/color], poison [b]Condition Immunities[/b] [color=magenta]charmed[/color], exhaustion, grappled, paralyzed, petrified, poisoned, prone, restrained[/indent] I'm inclined to make it susceptible to fear rather than immune to the frightened condition, since the original monster was a cautious combatant that "prefers to attack from ambush, and it avoids physically powerful targets that might easily break free of its grasp." I'll consider [b]Abilities[/b] next. The proposals for the undead "Blood Mist" are Str 9, Dex 16, Con 16, Int 9, Wis 14, Cha 9 which are too low for my taste, especially some of the mental stats. The early versions of the Crimson Death are super smart. They have "INTELLIGENCE: Genius (17-18)" in AD&D; in Third Edition, a Crimson Death has Str —, Dex 21, Con —, Int 17, Wis 15, Cha 14. I think those 3E ability scores work fine in 5E, so it just needs a Strength and Constitution. The CON 16 of the proposed 5E version is fine by me, but I'm tempted to make it CON 18 like a [b][url='https://www.5esrd.com/database/creature/vampire']Vampire[/url][/b]. That just leaves a Strength score. The AD&D Death "possesses strength equal to a normal human. It is able to carry a passive weight equal to an adult human." That suggests STR 10 (+0) or so. The 3E Death can "lift another creature or an object weighing up to 300 pounds" and has a +11 grapple. That means it has a +5 modifier on its grapple as its Base Attack Bonus is only +6 (due to undead having pathetic BAB in 3E). I presume they just had it use its +5 DEX modifier for grapple checks and forgot to mention it in the text. Giving the 5E version STR 20 (+5) seems WAY too high. How about we average the "virtual" STR 21 of the 3E Crimson Death with the STR 9 of your Blood Mist and round to even, which results in STR 14 (+2). That's enough for it to haul victims about, but isn't too overpowered. It's worth pointing out that the 5E Carrying Rules say "You can push, drag, or lift a weight in pounds up to twice your carrying capacity (or 30 times your Strength score). While pushing or dragging weight in excess of your carrying capacity, your speed drops to 5 feet." Meaning a STR 10 (+0) Scarlet Death would be able to lift a 300 pound weight and move it around like the 3E one can, just more slowly (at speed 5 ft, so 10 feet if it dashes). A sustained 3E [i]telekinesis[/i] moves objects at 20 feet per round. Overall, I prefer the STR 10, CON 18 arrangement. Anyhow, putting the above together would make: [TABLE] [TR] [TH][CENTER]STR[/CENTER][/TH] [TH][CENTER]DEX[/CENTER][/TH] [TH][CENTER]CON[/CENTER][/TH] [TH][CENTER]INT[/CENTER][/TH] [TH][CENTER]WIS[/CENTER][/TH] [TH][CENTER]CHA[/CENTER][/TH] [/TR] [TR] [TD][COLOR=green][CENTER]10 (+0)[/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [TD][COLOR=green][CENTER]21 (+5)[/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [TD][COLOR=green][CENTER]18 (+4)[/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [TD][COLOR=green][CENTER]17 (+3)[/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [TD][COLOR=green][CENTER]15 (+2)[/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [TD][COLOR=green][CENTER]14 (+2)[/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD][COLOR=magenta][CENTER][I]or 14 (+2) [b]?[/b][/I][/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [TD][COLOR=magenta][CENTER] [/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [TD][COLOR=magenta][CENTER][I]or 16 (+3) [b]?[/b][/I][/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [TD][COLOR=magenta][CENTER] [/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [TD][COLOR=magenta][CENTER] [/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [TD][COLOR=magenta][CENTER] [/CENTER][/COLOR][/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] Does that look OK to you? [/QUOTE]
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