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<blockquote data-quote="Sacrosanct" data-source="post: 6658955" data-attributes="member: 15700">So I ask you again.&nbsp; Crack the Shell is a daily 5th level ability in 4e.&nbsp; I've already said that in earlier editions, pretty much anyone can do something very similar, whenever they want.&nbsp; Not the exact same effect of course, but similar.&nbsp; If a player wanted to do that in 4e, they have to meet the criteria of of that power before doing so.&nbsp; That is more limiting, by the very definition of what &quot;limiting&quot; means.&nbsp; Your solution was to allow that ability to occur more than just daily, and to open up other defined abilities for use even if they PC didn't even have it.&nbsp; I'm assuming a game balanced as well as 4e implies that you should follow those AEDU guidelines.&nbsp; It's a HUGE part of the core mechanic of the game.&nbsp; This isn't a position of ignorance of my position, because everything you have said clearly ignores that core AEDU assumption, and you're replacing a critical part of 4e's rule with your own houserules.&nbsp; There's nothing wrong with doing houserules of course, but you can't say version X is not limiting and basing that argument on the assumption of needed to completely redo the core mechanic.The bottom line is this:If a player wants to sunder the armor of an opponent in a game like AD&amp;D, you come up with a ruling like I had done earlier.&nbsp; Anyone can attempt it at any time.&nbsp; It was stated that if you wanted to do that in 4e it was &quot;easy&quot; because all you had to do was use &quot;crack the shell&quot;.&nbsp; However, that power is limited to fighters as a 5th level power that can only be done once per day.&nbsp; In what way is the 4e's version NOT more limiting than the AD&amp;D version?&nbsp; It's not.&nbsp; Unless you change the rules and ignore the AEDU guidelines.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Sacrosanct, post: 6658955, member: 15700"] So I ask you again. Crack the Shell is a daily 5th level ability in 4e. I've already said that in earlier editions, pretty much [i]anyone[/i] can do something very similar, whenever they want. Not the exact same effect of course, but similar. If a player wanted to do that in 4e, they have to meet the criteria of of that power before doing so. That is more limiting, by the very definition of what "limiting" means. Your solution was to allow that ability to occur more than just daily, and to open up other defined abilities for use even if they PC didn't even have it. I'm assuming a game balanced as well as 4e implies that you should follow those AEDU guidelines. It's a HUGE part of the core mechanic of the game. This isn't a position of ignorance of my position, because everything you have said clearly ignores that core AEDU assumption, and you're replacing a critical part of 4e's rule with your own houserules. There's nothing wrong with doing houserules of course, but you can't say version X is not limiting and basing that argument on the assumption of needed to completely redo the core mechanic. The bottom line is this: If a player wants to sunder the armor of an opponent in a game like AD&D, you come up with a ruling like I had done earlier. Anyone can attempt it at any time. It was stated that if you wanted to do that in 4e it was "easy" because all you had to do was use "crack the shell". However, that power is [i]limited[/i] to fighters as a 5th level power that can only be done once per day. In what way is the 4e's version NOT more limiting than the AD&D version? It's not. Unless you change the rules and ignore the AEDU guidelines. [/QUOTE]

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