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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Lyxen" data-source="post: 8620578" data-attributes="member: 7032025">No, it does not, read the sections about the role of dice, it's not even Rule 0, not even an option, 100% core rule from the DMG: "The extent to which you use them [the dice] is entirely up to you." Using average damage is used everywhere in the MM, for example.You'll find that it is, if you read all the rules. And once more, it's not even rule 0.Again, I've got a whole range of possibilities that I don't have in 4e, where I need a grid and roll everything (unless you want to use rule 0, but you'll find that it's way weaker in 4e than in 5e).Nope, 100% core rules here.But it is, actually. There are tons of orcs running towards me, it's part of me projecting myself in the game world to decide which I'm going to attack and how, the ones that barely survived a fireball or the ones which are still intact. It's visual, it means something. 4e has a tendency to equalize all that to the technical, and in particular with minions, where it does not matter.Are you kidding me ? From the start, it's my example, I said 100 orcs, deal with them, and how the fireball only affected some of them ? No, it's your inability to deal with the situation in 4e terms that causes you to want to equalise everything to minions with 1 hp. I can perfectly deal with three types of foes, dead, wounded, intact.They are not 4e minions, no, because it's an abstract concept that I dislike.Not necessarily, see the first point above.It's bad for this, because it does not take into account the narrative of what happened. The firecube in 4e CANNOT statistically wipe out all the minions, which is SILLY. Depending on its strength, the fireball in 5e can wipe them all out, or leave some wounded, which are easier to finish off. Much better narrative, very easy to visualise.Yes, he will not, because the system will forbid it. Restrictive system, unable to simulate Minas Tirith. Once more, better game designers than you or I have said it, 5e has been designed to be more open-ended system than 4e.Which is stupid, because then Boromir would not die. Again, a limitation of the system.Well, it's simple then, you don't need to face the Mordor hordes, you win by default, gee, why did they go through all the bother ? <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" />And my point is exactly that, by forcing 4e PCs to face only equal level foes in controlled numbers you are creating a system that, although technically much more perfect, cannot accommodate the situations that are in the genre, despite the fact that they are very entertaining.One of my battle in Avernus had 8th level PCs with about 200 red/madcaps and unlikely allies facing a horde of were creatures plus some devils, with infernal war machines in the mix. It was absolutely epic, sometimes the PCs faced adversaries of their level, sometimes scores of lowly devils, all dangerous to them, and applied appropriate tactics or died. I did NOT limit myself to formal technical fights of creatures of the level of PCs, I never did before 4e and I never did since. Because, in particular, players LOVE slaughtering hordes of foes, especially if THESE EXACT SAME FOES were causing them problem before.The difference is that I'm NOT trashing 4e, I'm just explaining why, my objectives being different, it's not as suitable to me. But I've never badwrongedfunned anyone playing 4e with different objectives in mind, just like in my exchanges with less biased people.Just read the rules, you'll see. And I'm not being mean, I'm just pointing out things that matter to me in a funny way, which people with a sense of humour appreciate, for example [USER=6877472]@James Gasik[/USER] who said he liked his firecubes.Thanks, it's exactly what I'm saying, I don't like 4e as it does not map to the way we are playing. And I don't like the minions mechanics, although I found it clever at start, because it does not model the fantasy that I have, that of the genre to me.However, I completely agree that if you have other preferences and objectives, it might be the better mechanic FOR YOU. It's not to me, because the bounded accuracy hs cleverly removed the need for that mechanic.And yet, you are backing away on all fronts, so... <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" /></blockquote>

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