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Message: <blockquote data-quote="smbakeresq" data-source="post: 7487798" data-attributes="member: 28301">Because it says in the monster description, which you probably glossed over.  It does not explicitly state a golem that is "standing and doing nothing" or awaiting a trigger is silent, that is correct.  I drew that inference that a motionless construct that does not breathe nor have a heartbeat nor any type of mechanical automation would make no sound.  To help me out list 5 to 10 sounds you think a motionless construct would make? <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f60e.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":cool:" title="Cool    :cool:"  data-smilie="6"data-shortname=":cool:" />My point is not everything is in the rules.  No where in rules does it state that the golem has a -1 stealth check, you have to look at the dex score, and then apply that to a skill that they don't a listing for, and then infer that a motionless, invisible golem is intelligent enough and wise enough while animated by a spirit that only lives to obey to take an action to attempt to conceal itself as an iron golem using the stealth skill:"Stealth. Make a Dexterity (Stealth) check when you attempt to conceal yourself from enemies, slink past guards, slip away without being noticed, or sneak up on someone without being seen or heard. "My argument is that if a golem is there and invisible then someone cast invisible on it in some way shape or form and it is either abandoned and just inanimate or ordered to stand motionless and silent (otherwise it automatically gives away its position by making sound) and then do something when a trigger occurs.  Its not even in initiative so there is the argument that it cant even take actions yet.  Your argument is that it is bad at concealing itself while invisible and motionless which means it must be making noise somehow to give away its location where in its description it never mentions any noise that it makes at all under any circumstances.  There is also no rule that says a creature that weighs thousands of pounds make noise when it walks at all, it is assumed by the ruleset that you would know that.  While the stealth action rules state that its stealth check would be -1 I wouldn't allow a stealth check if it tried to sneak up on someone as I would infer (but not in the rules anywhere) that it would make a lot of noise while it walks, so much so that it couldn't sneak up on you.And you partially quoted something I typed to set up a sort of straw man argument which is stupid and absurd when trying to make an argument and only done by those trying to deceive.  If you quote the full sentence then you would understand I was referring back to you stating that you wouldn't even make a roll part of your argument.Jesus do people really play this rigid, absolutist, completely conformist games where no logical conclusions and deductions and inferred knowledge is allowed in?  I saw this in the jump rule argument, that some people play that a STR 18 pc can jump 18' %100 of the time but one inch further and its DC 20 check and a huge failure rate and I thought it was an aberration.</blockquote>

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