Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
5e: the demystification of monsters?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="triqui" data-source="post: 6026285" data-attributes="member: 57948"><p>It's harder to model as a theory, but it might not too hard to playtest. You just need a bunch of people playtesting the thing. I think DDN has +80.000 playtesters, WotC only needs to make an adventure for lvl 5, with 8 ogres in an encounter. Then they can get feedback, from real gameplay. Some groups will have cause fear wizards, some others will have a lot of melee bruisers, others will have an archer fighter, and so on. But a real playtest will help here much more than a mathematical model. Not that I have anything against maths, being a math guy myself, but sometimes, you can't really model things in theorycrafting. That's why humans build wind tunnels, instead of using only fluid dynamics math models</p><p></p><p></p><p> My point is that, just as the 10th level party can combine powers, spells and traits, to get an effect that is bigger than the sum of it's parts, so can do the monsters. At lvl 10, is quite possible that the party can fly (depending on the editiion, and we don't know about 5e yet, but you get my point, I think). So, using only ogres, no matter how much of them, isn't going to pose a threat for a group of flying characters with bows. Unless you have more ogres than they have arrows, it's not even a combat. But at that same level, a Fire Giant Cleric that can dispel the fly effect, or some other effects, might balance the fight. The Ogres are going to play the same role as 4e minions. They are not there to make the 10th level players shudder, but to force them to spend a few extra resources (like a chain lightning), to make the combat against the fire giants more interesting, and (this is crucial) to give *verosimilitude* to the game world. Ussually, in all editions of D&D up to now, low level threats *dissapear* from the world. Once you get to high level, there are no longer orcs and ogres in the world. They are replaced fully by giants or devils. While it's cool to have new monsters to fight (and that's a BIG part of what D&D is, and the reason to have levels at all), it could be fine if you could use orcs and ogres for longer. Of course, this depends on how well balanced the bounded accuracy systems finally is. We are in the first stages of *alpha* design (not even beta). So there's a lot of work to be done. I think Mealrs already said that monsters were a bit low in the to-hit. Let's see how well or bad it finish.</p><p></p><p>That's why we are in the playtest, so you can give your concerns to WotC. Let's see if they manage to fix it <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="triqui, post: 6026285, member: 57948"] It's harder to model as a theory, but it might not too hard to playtest. You just need a bunch of people playtesting the thing. I think DDN has +80.000 playtesters, WotC only needs to make an adventure for lvl 5, with 8 ogres in an encounter. Then they can get feedback, from real gameplay. Some groups will have cause fear wizards, some others will have a lot of melee bruisers, others will have an archer fighter, and so on. But a real playtest will help here much more than a mathematical model. Not that I have anything against maths, being a math guy myself, but sometimes, you can't really model things in theorycrafting. That's why humans build wind tunnels, instead of using only fluid dynamics math models My point is that, just as the 10th level party can combine powers, spells and traits, to get an effect that is bigger than the sum of it's parts, so can do the monsters. At lvl 10, is quite possible that the party can fly (depending on the editiion, and we don't know about 5e yet, but you get my point, I think). So, using only ogres, no matter how much of them, isn't going to pose a threat for a group of flying characters with bows. Unless you have more ogres than they have arrows, it's not even a combat. But at that same level, a Fire Giant Cleric that can dispel the fly effect, or some other effects, might balance the fight. The Ogres are going to play the same role as 4e minions. They are not there to make the 10th level players shudder, but to force them to spend a few extra resources (like a chain lightning), to make the combat against the fire giants more interesting, and (this is crucial) to give *verosimilitude* to the game world. Ussually, in all editions of D&D up to now, low level threats *dissapear* from the world. Once you get to high level, there are no longer orcs and ogres in the world. They are replaced fully by giants or devils. While it's cool to have new monsters to fight (and that's a BIG part of what D&D is, and the reason to have levels at all), it could be fine if you could use orcs and ogres for longer. Of course, this depends on how well balanced the bounded accuracy systems finally is. We are in the first stages of *alpha* design (not even beta). So there's a lot of work to be done. I think Mealrs already said that monsters were a bit low in the to-hit. Let's see how well or bad it finish. That's why we are in the playtest, so you can give your concerns to WotC. Let's see if they manage to fix it :) [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
5e: the demystification of monsters?
Top