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<blockquote data-quote="Eirikrautha" data-source="post: 6361691" data-attributes="member: 6777843">I play 5e without a grid (just like one group I was a part of that played 2e without NWPs).&nbsp; It's more fun for us that way.Why is it a problem that the fighter can bend bars and the thief can't?&nbsp; This is a class feature... one of the reasons you take the class.&nbsp; Making it a skill or feat invalidates that class (see Pathfinder Rogue for more information).&nbsp; This would be the reason for multiclassing, not skills and feats.&nbsp; Either your class determines your character's features, or you make a classless game system where you can mix and match skills, feats, etc.&nbsp; Part of the issue is that 3e+ wanted both worlds, yet accomplished neither well.Anytime you delineate a rule, class feature, skill, or feat, you have limited your character's choices.&nbsp; It's unavoidable.&nbsp; But you do so in order to make adjudication more concrete.&nbsp; Once you start to fiddle with skills, feats, or whatever that then give bonuses to such choices, you create a gap between the haves and have nots that limits character choice even further.&nbsp; I prefer a style with wide limits set by class and not delineated down to minutia through lots of skill and feat bonuses.&nbsp; That's why I'm moving away from Pathfinder/3.5+ and enthusiastic about 5e.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Eirikrautha, post: 6361691, member: 6777843"] I play 5e without a grid (just like one group I was a part of that played 2e without NWPs). It's more fun for us that way. Why is it a problem that the fighter can bend bars and the thief can't? This is a class feature... one of the reasons you take the class. Making it a skill or feat invalidates that class (see [I]Pathfinder Rogue[/I] for more information). This would be the reason for multiclassing, not skills and feats. Either your class determines your character's features, or you make a classless game system where you can mix and match skills, feats, etc. Part of the issue is that 3e+ wanted both worlds, yet accomplished neither well. Anytime you delineate a rule, class feature, skill, or feat, you have limited your character's choices. It's unavoidable. But you do so in order to make adjudication more concrete. Once you start to fiddle with skills, feats, or whatever that then give bonuses to such choices, you create a gap between the haves and have nots that limits character choice even further. I prefer a style with wide limits set by class and not delineated down to minutia through lots of skill and feat bonuses. That's why I'm moving away from Pathfinder/3.5+ and enthusiastic about 5e. [/QUOTE]

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