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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Quickleaf" data-source="post: 6362247" data-attributes="member: 20323">You raise a good point that balance must be examined at the party level.Maybe a better way to describe the issue is that wizards have greater versatility of class options than fighters. So, a wizard can be built toward combat, exploration, roleplaying, or some balance of those things; indeed, a 5e wizard can choose which area they'll be strongest in on the fly! A warrior, OTOH, is squarely focused on combat (and has few options for expanding into other dimensions of play). Now I've had the pleasure of playing with some really great players of warrior PCs who brought a lot to the table outside of combat, but that was always by virtue of their own roleplaying skill in spite of the rules.  What I believe the argument for more versatile fighters is about is taking some of the more nebulous aspects of fighter that succeed or fail at the DM's whim (which can be good or bad, depending on the DM), and giving those expression in the rules. Doing so also could be seen as an imagination tool to inspire fighter players...just as spell descriptions can inspire wizard players.You might not agree, but what I've just described is an entirely legitimate position. It's not saying D&D 5e is broken unbalanced, it's just saying there's room for improvement. Much in the way that Inspiration has been well received as codifying in the rules something that was happening at many tables anyhow.I think there's a similar shift happening at some gaming tables in regards to players' perception of classes. In the past, players expected that if they were beginners they wouldn't start with a faster class because those were more complex than warrior classes. Likewise, players who wanted more agency would play casters for the reasons [MENTION=6696971]Manbearcat[/MENTION] describes. Today I think more players are interested in divorcing (a) complexity and (b) agency from classes. So a caster could be simple or complex, provide limited or expansive agency. Likewise a warrior could be simple or complex, provide limited or expansive agency.But maybe I'm wrong?</blockquote>

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