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*Dungeons & Dragons
5th Edition -- Caster Rule, Martials Drool?
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<blockquote data-quote="Remathilis" data-source="post: 6364765" data-attributes="member: 7635"><p>It sounds like you are interested in one of three fixes:</p><p>a.) Spells that scale with caster level (so that spells scale without resorting to spell slot upping)</p><p>b.) An inverse spell acquisition (As PCs level, they get more spell slots in higher levels than in lower, IE a fifth level caster with 2 first, 3 second, and 4 third level spell slots)</p><p>c.) A way to "trade up" by combining low level spell slots in higher ones (typically done via a spell point system). </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>"Mooks" is a relative term in 5e. There's a thread somewhere around here where someone posits 24 orcs can kill a 20th level fighter in a half-dozen rounds thanks to bounded accuracy. Unlike 3e, where you typically fought an opponent with a CR equal to PC's level +1d4-1, 5e is much more interested in smaller encounters to augment the big battles; 4e was the era of big set-piece encounters every battle. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, this comes back to "I want magic all the time". A wizard is not DPS; a single sleep spell should make the wizard feel productive. I can't believe in a thread where people are complaining about forcecage and polymorph you can come in and say "wizard's are productive in most encounters". </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This completely contradicts what you just said. How can a fighter be amazing if the wizard is constantly bringing to bear "spells better than melee attacks". Melee is a constant damage output, magic is spike damage. The only way to even them out is to make them do the same thing. (Melee getting attacks that scale on par with magic, magic getting reliable use equal to melee attacks.) Now, where did I see that before? Oh yeah. Fourth Edition. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Every class has HD. Bards can heal every short rest. Fighter frickin regenerate if you chain enough short rests/second winds together. Healing is NOT something PCs lack for except at levels 1-3. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>See, you're trapped in the same negative feedback loop: you only want "meaningful encounters" and then you only want "your best attacks" because everything else is useless against it. How bout using those low level spells on those "mook" encounters? Burning Hands still fries goblins the same at 5th level as it did at 1st. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Challenging, meaningful encounters every round? Check. Healing spread out and used as a method of resource depletion? Check. Having your best magic for every encounter? Check. Magic not outshining Martial Check. </p><p></p><p>You want fourth edition. Go check out Heroes of the Fallen Kingdom; I think it might just be what you're looking for!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Remathilis, post: 6364765, member: 7635"] It sounds like you are interested in one of three fixes: a.) Spells that scale with caster level (so that spells scale without resorting to spell slot upping) b.) An inverse spell acquisition (As PCs level, they get more spell slots in higher levels than in lower, IE a fifth level caster with 2 first, 3 second, and 4 third level spell slots) c.) A way to "trade up" by combining low level spell slots in higher ones (typically done via a spell point system). "Mooks" is a relative term in 5e. There's a thread somewhere around here where someone posits 24 orcs can kill a 20th level fighter in a half-dozen rounds thanks to bounded accuracy. Unlike 3e, where you typically fought an opponent with a CR equal to PC's level +1d4-1, 5e is much more interested in smaller encounters to augment the big battles; 4e was the era of big set-piece encounters every battle. Again, this comes back to "I want magic all the time". A wizard is not DPS; a single sleep spell should make the wizard feel productive. I can't believe in a thread where people are complaining about forcecage and polymorph you can come in and say "wizard's are productive in most encounters". This completely contradicts what you just said. How can a fighter be amazing if the wizard is constantly bringing to bear "spells better than melee attacks". Melee is a constant damage output, magic is spike damage. The only way to even them out is to make them do the same thing. (Melee getting attacks that scale on par with magic, magic getting reliable use equal to melee attacks.) Now, where did I see that before? Oh yeah. Fourth Edition. Every class has HD. Bards can heal every short rest. Fighter frickin regenerate if you chain enough short rests/second winds together. Healing is NOT something PCs lack for except at levels 1-3. See, you're trapped in the same negative feedback loop: you only want "meaningful encounters" and then you only want "your best attacks" because everything else is useless against it. How bout using those low level spells on those "mook" encounters? Burning Hands still fries goblins the same at 5th level as it did at 1st. Challenging, meaningful encounters every round? Check. Healing spread out and used as a method of resource depletion? Check. Having your best magic for every encounter? Check. Magic not outshining Martial Check. You want fourth edition. Go check out Heroes of the Fallen Kingdom; I think it might just be what you're looking for! [/QUOTE]
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