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<blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 7665020" data-attributes="member: 996">Nod, but that doesn't mean those things don't exist, just that they might not matter.&nbsp; Easy checks do happen in the context of level-appropriate challenges. &nbsp;I think that's very much up to the DM.&nbsp; You can run status quo in 4e, you might stat the exact same monsters as heroic Solos or Epic minions depending on the party, as you mentioned, above, but skills are less confusing.&nbsp; A 21 DC lock is 21 DC, the level of the party just determines whether that's a hard, moderate or easy DC.&nbsp; &nbsp;Well, they grow in hp and damage potential.&nbsp; A 21 DC lock that you couldn't pick at 1st because you're not into locks is still unpickable at 20th unless you've become proficient with theives tools in the meantime.&nbsp;&nbsp;It'd be pretty similar.&nbsp; &nbsp;Sure.&nbsp; Maybe I'm just not seeing the significance of the distinction.&nbsp;You could have a party with no healers, thus only HD and overnight healing (and 'common' healing potions that they find/buy) to see them through.&nbsp; Or you could have a party where everyone has cure..wound prepared every day, and some of them know how to /make/ healing potions, as well.&nbsp; So you have a similar mechanic (surges ~ HD), but a very dissimilar result (total out-of-combat healing resources being somewhat consistent regardless of party composition, or varying wildly with party composition).&nbsp;One thing I've noticed, this is just IMX, though I think the numbers bear it out, is that 1st level 5e characters cannot handle the 'standard' 6-8 moderate-hard encounter day.&nbsp; So, I'd expect most groups to 'learn' to rest more frequently at low level, and maybe un-learn that necessity later (or not, depending, in part on party composition, and how any players with healing-capable PC chose to use their spell resources).&nbsp;There's a clear line from 3e to 4e to 5e, when it comes to basic mechanics, sure.&nbsp; 5e hasn't gone back to THAC0 or anything like that, it's still very much a d20 game - heck 3pps have already started producing for it using the d20 OGL.&nbsp; Similarly, monster stat blocks, while formatted to look a bit more like the classic game, also show a clear debt to 3e/Pathfinder and 4e.Class design, OTOH, seems to go from 1e to 2e to 5e, with similarities to 3e being, not coincidental, per se, but not a matter of improving on 3e so much as improving on 2e in a way similar to what 3e did.&nbsp; If that subtle distinction makes any sense.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Tony Vargas, post: 7665020, member: 996"] Nod, but that doesn't mean those things don't exist, just that they might not matter. Easy checks do happen in the context of level-appropriate challenges. I think that's very much up to the DM. You can run status quo in 4e, you might stat the exact same monsters as heroic Solos or Epic minions depending on the party, as you mentioned, above, but skills are less confusing. A 21 DC lock is 21 DC, the level of the party just determines whether that's a hard, moderate or easy DC. Well, they grow in hp and damage potential. A 21 DC lock that you couldn't pick at 1st because you're not into locks is still unpickable at 20th unless you've become proficient with theives tools in the meantime. It'd be pretty similar. Sure. Maybe I'm just not seeing the significance of the distinction. You could have a party with no healers, thus only HD and overnight healing (and 'common' healing potions that they find/buy) to see them through. Or you could have a party where everyone has cure..wound prepared every day, and some of them know how to /make/ healing potions, as well. So you have a similar mechanic (surges ~ HD), but a very dissimilar result (total out-of-combat healing resources being somewhat consistent regardless of party composition, or varying wildly with party composition). One thing I've noticed, this is just IMX, though I think the numbers bear it out, is that 1st level 5e characters cannot handle the 'standard' 6-8 moderate-hard encounter day. So, I'd expect most groups to 'learn' to rest more frequently at low level, and maybe un-learn that necessity later (or not, depending, in part on party composition, and how any players with healing-capable PC chose to use their spell resources). There's a clear line from 3e to 4e to 5e, when it comes to basic mechanics, sure. 5e hasn't gone back to THAC0 or anything like that, it's still very much a d20 game - heck 3pps have already started producing for it using the d20 OGL. Similarly, monster stat blocks, while formatted to look a bit more like the classic game, also show a clear debt to 3e/Pathfinder and 4e. Class design, OTOH, seems to go from 1e to 2e to 5e, with similarities to 3e being, not coincidental, per se, but not a matter of improving on 3e so much as improving on 2e in a way similar to what 3e did. If that subtle distinction makes any sense. [/QUOTE]

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