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<blockquote data-quote="Oofta" data-source="post: 9511232" data-attributes="member: 6801845">From a game balance perspective, clerics have been given spells and abilities roughly on par with the other classes.&nbsp; Having them be able to ring up their god and to receive a get out of jail card breaks that balance for me. I know there could be a cost but what kind?&nbsp; Find a different McGuffin?&nbsp; Well apparently Odin knows where that one is to so why does he need any help?&nbsp; Kill some other mortal?&nbsp; Well if Odin is all powerful and ready to intervene in mortal affairs why doesn't he just point Gungnir at the mortal and declare him dead?&nbsp; That and any &quot;price&quot; the cleric had to pay would realistically have been paid by the whole group.&nbsp; We would have just been substituting one story arc for another.From a game world perspective, Odin is not a &quot;good&quot; god, at least not any more.&nbsp; He's obsessed with Ragnarok and punishing Loki.&nbsp; He's more concerned with stirring up wars so that he has more Einherjar for the final battle.&nbsp; Besides, if the cleric dies in battle trying to hunt down the lich, the cleric becomes another soldier in Odin's army.&nbsp; Win for Odin!&nbsp; The fact that they were hunting down a lich doesn't really make a difference, avoiding death is Hel's problem, not his.Final thought?&nbsp; I don't see saying &quot;No you can't do that&quot; now and then, especially for something like asking for divine intervention when scrying attempts had been tried and failed, as a railroad.&nbsp; A cleric has several powers they've gained from their god.&nbsp; If they want more than that, that's what divine intervention is for. Even then, it's still up to DM discretion.&nbsp; There were many, many other routes for us to take.&nbsp; It would be like asking if I can get to work with my car and gee it would be nice if my car could fly. Yes, it would be nice but while there are several routes to where I want to go, flying in my car isn't one of them.&nbsp; I don't see an issue with limitations on characters. Besides, if Odin had intervened, that just means one player dictated that the rest of the group must pursue whatever payment Odin demanded.&nbsp; BTW stop being snarky if you want to have a discussion.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Oofta, post: 9511232, member: 6801845"] From a game balance perspective, clerics have been given spells and abilities roughly on par with the other classes. Having them be able to ring up their god and to receive a get out of jail card breaks that balance for me. I know there could be a cost but what kind? Find a different McGuffin? Well apparently Odin knows where that one is to so why does he need any help? Kill some other mortal? Well if Odin is all powerful and ready to intervene in mortal affairs why doesn't he just point Gungnir at the mortal and declare him dead? That and any "price" the cleric had to pay would realistically have been paid by the whole group. We would have just been substituting one story arc for another. From a game world perspective, Odin is not a "good" god, at least not any more. He's [I]obsessed[/I] with Ragnarok and punishing Loki. He's more concerned with stirring up wars so that he has more Einherjar for the final battle. Besides, if the cleric dies in battle trying to hunt down the lich, the cleric becomes another soldier in Odin's army. Win for Odin! The fact that they were hunting down a lich doesn't really make a difference, avoiding death is Hel's problem, not his. Final thought? I don't see saying "No you can't do that" now and then, especially for something like asking for divine intervention when scrying attempts had been tried and failed, as a railroad. A cleric has several powers they've gained from their god. If they want more than that, that's what divine intervention is for. Even then, it's still up to DM discretion. There were many, many other routes for us to take. It would be like asking if I can get to work with my car and gee it would be nice if my car could fly. Yes, it would be nice but while there are several routes to where I want to go, flying in my car isn't one of them. I don't see an issue with limitations on characters. Besides, if Odin had intervened, that just means one player dictated that the rest of the group must pursue whatever payment Odin demanded. BTW stop being snarky if you want to have a discussion. [/QUOTE]

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