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<blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 9515525" data-attributes="member: 6785785">But what if page 793 of the DMs notes indicates that in this game world, spiders are rare and are always spies for Lolth, and so are generally killed on sight? I mean, if we can't assume that patrons are in a tavern or that a town will have a blacksmith, why would we assume spiders are common? Kidding aside... what if the DM shot the idea down? That's their right, as you've been saying. They could declare this action impossible. Or they could work with the player's idea. They could collaborate and find something that works for everyone. So, does a DM have to disclose everything that's impossible to try ahead of play? Like, you expect that it was explicitly stated before play &quot;Gods never do anything but give you spells&quot;? Or was it more implied? And either way, don't things change sometimes? Couldn't there be some kind of divine champion that's never been seen before who can work miracles greater than most clerics? Why would players just assume that, when it comes to magic and the cosmic or divine, all is known and things can never change? Gotcha. Yeah, I wouldn't say that was &quot;all because of one player&quot;. But it's a cool example where a player certainly played a part in the way things go. Again... imagine the DM just shot it down. Because you seem to think I'm arguing something I'm not. I'm talking about trying ways to collaborate with players, and you've been arguing for the DM's right to not do so... and then you share examples that show the DM trying to collaborate with players.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="hawkeyefan, post: 9515525, member: 6785785"] But what if page 793 of the DMs notes indicates that in this game world, spiders are rare and are always spies for Lolth, and so are generally killed on sight? I mean, if we can't assume that patrons are in a tavern or that a town will have a blacksmith, why would we assume spiders are common? Kidding aside... what if the DM shot the idea down? That's their right, as you've been saying. They could declare this action impossible. Or they could work with the player's idea. They could collaborate and find something that works for everyone. So, does a DM have to disclose everything that's impossible to try ahead of play? Like, you expect that it was explicitly stated before play "Gods never do anything but give you spells"? Or was it more implied? And either way, don't things change sometimes? Couldn't there be some kind of divine champion that's never been seen before who can work miracles greater than most clerics? Why would players just assume that, when it comes to magic and the cosmic or divine, all is known and things can never change? Gotcha. Yeah, I wouldn't say that was "all because of one player". But it's a cool example where a player certainly played a part in the way things go. Again... imagine the DM just shot it down. Because you seem to think I'm arguing something I'm not. I'm talking about trying ways to collaborate with players, and you've been arguing for the DM's right to not do so... and then you share examples that show the DM trying to collaborate with players. [/QUOTE]

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