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<blockquote data-quote="DND_Reborn" data-source="post: 7963681" data-attributes="member: 6987520">Ok, first you should stop calling for things like moon druids, etc. because there aren't any. That is the point.I didn't strip the other things because those are core class features, just as wild shape is.It is meaningful utility. I can't help that you don't see that. There are all sort of situations, having used the ability in AD&amp;D often enough, I know from experience. And they certainly don't have to be &quot;contrived&quot;. Even in our 5E group, our druid uses his wild shape for utility all the time. One example was changing into a giant spider while carrying my female elf (invisible) into the lair for the assault we had planned. I would not have been able to get into that position by myself since I can't concentrate on more than one spell.I might be able to see an argument for bumping the CR a bit, so it caps out around CR 3 instead of 2. But that's about it.EDIT: Let me explain this. Characters are not meant to be as powerful as RAW when I removed the subclasses. Look at my fighter write-up. Do you think a few proficiencies and Many Leagues makes up for the BM maneuvers? Or the criticals and remarkable athlete features? No. I am removing huge damage potential from the fighter class. But that is by design. So, your issue seems more related to my druid is not as strong as a RAW druid with subclasses. It isn't supposed to be. Maybe that helps?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="DND_Reborn, post: 7963681, member: 6987520"] Ok, first you should stop calling for things like moon druids, etc. because there aren't any. That is the point. I didn't strip the other things because those are core class features, just as wild shape is. It is meaningful utility. I can't help that you don't see that. There are all sort of situations, having used the ability in AD&D often enough, I know from experience. And they certainly don't have to be "contrived". Even in our 5E group, our druid uses his wild shape for utility all the time. One example was changing into a giant spider while carrying my female elf (invisible) into the lair for the assault we had planned. I would not have been able to get into that position by myself since I can't concentrate on more than one spell. I might be able to see an argument for bumping the CR a bit, so it caps out around CR 3 instead of 2. But that's about it. EDIT: Let me explain this. Characters are not meant to be as powerful as RAW when I removed the subclasses. Look at my fighter write-up. Do you think a few proficiencies and Many Leagues makes up for the BM maneuvers? Or the criticals and remarkable athlete features? No. I am removing huge damage potential from the fighter class. But that is by design. So, your issue seems more related to my druid is not as strong as a RAW druid with subclasses. It isn't supposed to be. Maybe that helps? [/QUOTE]

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