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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 4752382" data-attributes="member: 22779">Something I completely agree with.  There's a first.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />HowandWhy, I was thinking about your model on my drive home tonight and let's see if I'm understanding this correctly.If I'm understanding you correctly, the only way an act actually becomes role playing is if it directly models the action being done in the game world.  Like you say, saying "I swing my sword" is not roleplaying.  Only 1:1 correlation counts as roleplaying.  (The ratio may not be exact, but, the closer it comes to 1:1, the better it becomes roleplaying.)So, let's apply your definition to various games and see where it leads.  I'm going to list a series of games/activities in order of closest to 1:1 correlation (those activities which most qualify as role play) to those the furthest away (and thus least qualify as role play). 1.  SCA and historical reenactment.  This is about as close to actually doing it as you can get without someone getting seriously hurt. 2.  Boffer Larp.  We are further away from 1:1 correlation, but, it's still pretty close. 3.  Mind's Eye Theater.  While the mechanics are very abstract, they don't get used all that often.  The majority of action is resolved directly. 4.  Microsoft Flight Simulator and various other high end simulation computer games.  This is about as close to actual flying as you can get while staying on the ground. 5.  First person shooters.  Your actions directly correlate with the actions in the game.  With more and more realistic physics engines, the ratio creeps slowly closer to 1. 6.  Tabletop wargames.  Such as Warhammer or Battletech or Star Fleet Battles.  Again, your actions are modeled in incredible detail.  You need to proceed step by step (in Star Fleet Battles, the steps can be painstaking) and the rules are the least abstract they can be while staying on a tabletop.  Warhammer is perhaps the least of these, but there are various other miniatures games like Advanced Squad Leader which would qualify. 7.  Free Form RPG's.  Since these games lack any mechanics, you have to detail out every step as you go.  8.  Rolemaster/GURPS.  Any gaming system which heavily relies on emulating a given reality as closely to actual as possible.  You never just "swing your sword" in Rolemaster or GURPS.  9.  Mainstream RPG's.  D&D obviously.  Vampire as well.  Conflict resolution rules are fairly abstract and have very little to do with what actually occurs in the game world.  About the only 1:1 correlation that ever occurs is when the player speaks in the first person with his character.  Even the character itself is a fairly abstract collection of rules with little or no bearing on the real world. 10.  Various Indie games.  Dogs in the Vineyard comes to mind here.  Here we have mechanics that actually get used during first person interactions.  The Stakes mechanics in DITV are highly abstract. This is why I say that HowandWhy's model is utter bupkis.  Any definition of roleplay that would put Halo on a higher shelf than D&D is not a definition of roleplay that I would subscribe to.</blockquote>

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