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<blockquote data-quote="Sir Brennen" data-source="post: 2997999" data-attributes="member: 553">I say dump the initial check altogether - if facing a fairly powerful undead, it's still an all-or-nothing mechanic. In fact, you've increased the odds of a &quot;nothing&quot; result for powerful undead, since a Cleric without a great CHA bonus and a low roll on his d12 still might not do any damage once HD are subtracted, even if he made the initial check. And the second roll, the damage calculation, is another strange, non-standard mechanic just like the original level check which you've modified. I mean, what other spell or special ability has it's damage dice randomly determined, and then modified by the target's HD? Just go with a saving throw if you want damage to be reduced.&nbsp; (Also, how would Turn Resistance play into your system? Also subtracted from the d12 + Level + Cha number?)I use a &quot;Turning causes HP Damage&quot; variant in my <a href="http://home.comcast.net/~joemoon5/tian/index.html#TurningUndead" target="_blank">own campaign</a>. High level it boils down to this:There's quite a few related changes stemming from this, but the basics are a lot simpler, I think.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Sir Brennen, post: 2997999, member: 553"] I say dump the initial check altogether - if facing a fairly powerful undead, it's still an all-or-nothing mechanic. In fact, you've increased the odds of a "nothing" result for powerful undead, since a Cleric without a great CHA bonus and a low roll on his d12 still might not do any damage once HD are subtracted, even if he made the initial check. And the second roll, the damage calculation, is another strange, non-standard mechanic just like the original level check which you've modified. I mean, what other spell or special ability has it's damage [i]dice[/i] randomly determined, and then modified by the target's HD? Just go with a saving throw if you want damage to be reduced. (Also, how would Turn Resistance play into your system? Also subtracted from the d12 + Level + Cha number?) I use a "Turning causes HP Damage" variant in my [url=http://home.comcast.net/~joemoon5/tian/index.html#TurningUndead][b][color=orange]own campaign[/color][/b][/url]. High level it boils down to this: There's quite a few related changes stemming from this, but the basics are a lot simpler, I think. [/QUOTE]

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