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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pming" data-source="post: 7228094" data-attributes="member: 45197">Hiya!Any of your alternatives would work just fine, I'd wager. That said...in my game I simply account that "Proficiency" means a character is better/more knowledgeable than one without. This has NOTHING to do with chance of success...only the definition of what that success (or failure) entails. Let me 'splain. No, would take to long. Let me sum up...A character WITH Proficiency is just 'better' at something. Lets use ye old Perception. A Fighter with a Wisdom of 12 and NO Proficiency, at 1st level, has +1. A Cleric with a Wisdom of 18 and NO Proficiency, at 1st level, as a +4. No harm, no foul in this case...the Cleric will succeed a slight bit more. Lets assume both SUCCEED at a test:DM: Ok, Fighter and Cleric, you both slow down your walk then stop, looking at each other, then the corridor in front of you. Something just seems off about the way the stonework is shaped, or the texture, or colour of the stones seems out of place for some reason. Maybe it's less cobwebs than the other corridors, or maybe something else.Neither PC has any advantage over the other in terms of "definition of success". Now, lets move on. Lets now assume that the Fighter DOES have Proficiency, but the Cleric does not. Lets once again assume both SUCCEED at the test:DM: Cleric, something about this corridor seems to get your attention. You can't quiet put your finger on it. Fighter, you stop with the Cleric. You notice that this corridor has less cobwebs and even dirt on the floor, and the flagstones are of a different type of stone, or maybe they are less-worn from being walked on, you can't be certain. The walls seem mostly the same, as does the ceiling, at least in regards to the rest of the corridor you've all be walking down.That's how I play it. A character without Proficiency, who SUCCEEDS, will succeed with the BARE MINIMUM needed to be considered a success. Those who do have Proficiency, who FAIL, will sometimes get a hint, but those that SUCCEED will do so with much greater accuracy and "effect" than others. In my game, someone rolling a 12 and succeeding, and someone rolling a 24 and succeeding...well, whichever one has Proficiency does it 'best'; if the 12 guy was the one with Prof, he does it expertly...the guy with the 24, does it "as well as could be expected from someone untrained" (which, mind you, with a roll of 24 is still going to be a pretty sweet success...but the skilled guy with a 12 will do just as well).Also, as a side note, I use the Ability in question for the Skill as a "most of the time" stat...but they are never an "always" stat. (e.g., Athletics is STR...but only 'usually'; if DEX makes more sense, I use that...if INT makes more sense, I use that, if CHA makes more sense, I use that...etc; it's ALWAYS SITUATIONAL, but usually the default is 'good enough').^_^Paul L. Ming</blockquote>

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