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A Paladin Shows Mercy to a Priestess of Orcus?
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<blockquote data-quote="MonkeyDragon" data-source="post: 2379274" data-attributes="member: 23929"><p>Like someone else said, if just being around someone who was evil counted as associating, no one would ever get redeemed. The paladin isn't hanging out with the priestess because she likes her, or thinks she'd be a good person to have in the party. She's more like her jailor. And I don't think that the priestess acting on behalf of the party suddenly switches it to an association. As long as the paladin intends his relationship with the priestess to either redeem her or to prevent her from hurting anyone else, I would say that her honor is intact. </p><p></p><p>I would, in fact, be more inclined to tsk over her honor if she hadn't granted mercy. Not that a paladin should be merciful in every given situation. Sometimes it just isn't practical. But if a foe surrenders, and, helpless, begs for mercy, and the paladin is in a position to grant it, I can think of nothing that would be more in keeping with her honor.</p><p></p><p>The thing that leaves a bad taste in my mouth is the notion of forcing the priestess to serve her. It seems like she's turning her into a sort of slave, since she has to obey on pain of death, and the paladin benifits from having her around. As a DM, though, I wouldn't have a problem with forcing her to swear to loyalty, as long as the pally didn't treat her like a slave, and used that vow simply as a means of controling her while she's in her custody. She would also have to actively work towards redeeming her.</p><p></p><p>As far as the legitimate authority thing goes, I don't think there needs to be a conflict. If there is a higher up in her order that the paladin reports to, and she brings the pristess to them, that is fullfilling her honor and code. If they say the priestess needs to die, she should simply explain that she'd given the cleric mercy, and ask them to spare her life. If they judge that she should be executed anyway, it kind of sucks, and the paladin might feel bad, but it's not an affront to her honor. She tried, and she should at least be able to ensure that the priestess gets a swift and painless death. Thats a lot more merciful than being flamestriked to death bit by bit.</p><p></p><p>I think that it would be wise to make it clear to her that she has X amount of time...your standard year and a day, perhaps...to repent. After that, if she still has evil in her heart, then she gets the sword. She can't expect more than that.</p><p></p><p>I would rule that if the cleric turned from evil and Orcus to goodness (or at least un-bad neutrality) and a different god, then her soul would go to the good place when she died. If she had actually given or sold her soul to Orcus, then it gets messier, but I would allow for a way to save her. Perhaps...a quest! Wouldn't THAT be an interesting plot twist? The priestess now follows the faith of the paladin, but they know that when she dies, she goes to Orcus for all kinds of torment. Now it's a race against time...and demon prince minions, to find a way to claim her soul for the good god.</p><p></p><p>Does all this EXACTLY follow the raw for the paladin? I don't know. Does it matter? I don't think so. So often one runs into problems with paladins either trying to weasel out of their obligations when they're inconvienant for the player, following the letter of their code but not the spirit, or getting drunk on richeous might and smiting everything in sight. I think it would be a shame to use the rules to hamstring a character who is actually trying to just do the right thing. Sides, it makes for excellent roleplaying.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="MonkeyDragon, post: 2379274, member: 23929"] Like someone else said, if just being around someone who was evil counted as associating, no one would ever get redeemed. The paladin isn't hanging out with the priestess because she likes her, or thinks she'd be a good person to have in the party. She's more like her jailor. And I don't think that the priestess acting on behalf of the party suddenly switches it to an association. As long as the paladin intends his relationship with the priestess to either redeem her or to prevent her from hurting anyone else, I would say that her honor is intact. I would, in fact, be more inclined to tsk over her honor if she hadn't granted mercy. Not that a paladin should be merciful in every given situation. Sometimes it just isn't practical. But if a foe surrenders, and, helpless, begs for mercy, and the paladin is in a position to grant it, I can think of nothing that would be more in keeping with her honor. The thing that leaves a bad taste in my mouth is the notion of forcing the priestess to serve her. It seems like she's turning her into a sort of slave, since she has to obey on pain of death, and the paladin benifits from having her around. As a DM, though, I wouldn't have a problem with forcing her to swear to loyalty, as long as the pally didn't treat her like a slave, and used that vow simply as a means of controling her while she's in her custody. She would also have to actively work towards redeeming her. As far as the legitimate authority thing goes, I don't think there needs to be a conflict. If there is a higher up in her order that the paladin reports to, and she brings the pristess to them, that is fullfilling her honor and code. If they say the priestess needs to die, she should simply explain that she'd given the cleric mercy, and ask them to spare her life. If they judge that she should be executed anyway, it kind of sucks, and the paladin might feel bad, but it's not an affront to her honor. She tried, and she should at least be able to ensure that the priestess gets a swift and painless death. Thats a lot more merciful than being flamestriked to death bit by bit. I think that it would be wise to make it clear to her that she has X amount of time...your standard year and a day, perhaps...to repent. After that, if she still has evil in her heart, then she gets the sword. She can't expect more than that. I would rule that if the cleric turned from evil and Orcus to goodness (or at least un-bad neutrality) and a different god, then her soul would go to the good place when she died. If she had actually given or sold her soul to Orcus, then it gets messier, but I would allow for a way to save her. Perhaps...a quest! Wouldn't THAT be an interesting plot twist? The priestess now follows the faith of the paladin, but they know that when she dies, she goes to Orcus for all kinds of torment. Now it's a race against time...and demon prince minions, to find a way to claim her soul for the good god. Does all this EXACTLY follow the raw for the paladin? I don't know. Does it matter? I don't think so. So often one runs into problems with paladins either trying to weasel out of their obligations when they're inconvienant for the player, following the letter of their code but not the spirit, or getting drunk on richeous might and smiting everything in sight. I think it would be a shame to use the rules to hamstring a character who is actually trying to just do the right thing. Sides, it makes for excellent roleplaying. [/QUOTE]
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