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<blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 8191560" data-attributes="member: 18">Oh ok - pretty sure the answer is &quot;because that's how Gary Gygax envisioned Vancian magic working&quot;.I mean, maybe this answers your verisimilitude point too - the verisimilitude is to, what, Vance's Dying Earth books? Which to Gary seem to have the most suitable or persuasive spell system for this new game he was making. So, question for someone who has read them - in the Dying Earth books, do casters foul up spells without anyone interfering with them? If that's not something that happens in those books, why would Gary invent mechanics for it?It's a very common theme in some fantasy - the &quot;I can't move my hands/say the words well enough to cast the spell!&quot;. But was it a common theme in the Dying Earth books? They have a totally bizarre take on magic, that's haunted D&amp;D through the years and is I think part of why D&amp;D has had so many heartbreakers and competitors and so on, because so many people can't stand it, and it just can't work with a lot of fantasy settings. In those settings I can think of where people can foul up spells themselves, they don't have anything like Vancian magic, note.Also, could you not just do like 4E did and have the caster roll instead of the target save and say it's this. Mathematically isn't that basically identical in modern editions? You're just swapping who is rolling.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ruin Explorer, post: 8191560, member: 18"] Oh ok - pretty sure the answer is "because that's how Gary Gygax envisioned Vancian magic working". I mean, maybe this answers your verisimilitude point too - the verisimilitude is to, what, Vance's Dying Earth books? Which to Gary seem to have the most suitable or persuasive spell system for this new game he was making. So, question for someone who has read them - in the Dying Earth books, do casters foul up spells without anyone interfering with them? If that's not something that happens in those books, why would Gary invent mechanics for it? It's a very common theme in some fantasy - the "I can't move my hands/say the words well enough to cast the spell!". But was it a common theme in the Dying Earth books? They have a totally bizarre take on magic, that's haunted D&D through the years and is I think part of why D&D has had so many heartbreakers and competitors and so on, because so many people can't stand it, and it just can't work with a lot of fantasy settings. In those settings I can think of where people can foul up spells themselves, they don't have anything like Vancian magic, note. Also, could you not just do like 4E did and have the caster roll instead of the target save and say it's this. Mathematically isn't that basically identical in modern editions? You're just swapping who is rolling. [/QUOTE]

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