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<blockquote data-quote="Warren Okuma" data-source="post: 3955936" data-attributes="member: 48436">Pick.&nbsp; Walk.&nbsp; There are tons of small &quot;uneconomical&quot; deposits of coal all over the place, which the major industrial concerns ignore.&nbsp; Salvage solar panels or wind turbines from country homes and get those air pumps to work.&nbsp; Or generators and distil alcohol.&nbsp; Or make a steam engine.&nbsp; And if you can easily make an electrical generator if need be.&nbsp; Hell generator kits are sold to ten year olds (you did check out that link, right?).&nbsp; Mines will be up and running. They can move.&nbsp; Yeah it's a hardship but it beats dying from freezing. Yup.&nbsp; Centers of tech.This was a island situation, so it will not have a desert.&nbsp; I agree with you that desert communities are not going to fare so well.&nbsp; But Texas and other southern states will carry the ball.&nbsp; People move all the time.And there is a huge junkyard full of rusting metal outside of Honolulu.&nbsp; Cranes, tractors, cars, trucks, rebar, and other metal junk that won't be vaporized.&nbsp; They don't put junkyards and dumps near the city.&nbsp; I donno how it's like where you live, but in Hawaii we put junkyards or trash dumps away from the city.&nbsp; Have you been to a major junkyard?&nbsp; If not I suggest you go a visit one, you are going to be in for a treat.Eh, early combustion engines are engines easy to make, and you can distil alcohol or use bio diesel.&nbsp; Not like that's hard to make.Broken engines.&nbsp; Stuff in garbage dumps, stuff in junk yards.&nbsp; Stuff dug out of the ground.Correct.&nbsp; They have to get the communities up and running and power fabrication grids.&nbsp; Long enough to get technology back up and running in that small area.All military vehicles have incredible machine shops.&nbsp; You can just anchor off shore and ferry stuff back and forth.&nbsp; When the ships wear out you salvage the machine shops.We got the point that you will be dead and you will not be able to rebuild civilization.&nbsp; There are tons of machines out in the countyside that can do fabrication.&nbsp;&nbsp; Car repair, tractor repair, general fabrication, contractors, and customizers...quite a few of them are located outside of the city.&nbsp; You measure the part and fabricate it to that specs.&nbsp; The you fit it.&nbsp; If it's too big you work on it some more.&nbsp; You don't have to use brass and copper if you are going to make a crank start engine.&nbsp; Electrical start engines need copper and brass.&nbsp; Yes, normal carbon steel will wear out 5-15% quicker, but you can still build engines.&nbsp; Or you can always overbuild as well.Not really, it's a centuries old tech.&nbsp; And if you want to build a crank start engine, all you need is steel.&nbsp; My cousin built one, and he's not the smartest tool in the shed.&nbsp; He can't walk an chew gum at the same time.Nah, interstate commerce will not break down.&nbsp; Too many work arounds such as distilling alcohol and making biodiesel.&nbsp; And the US oil fields will be up and running hook or by crook.&nbsp; All it is drilling holes and pumping out stuff, if not alcohol or biodiesel.Let's see.&nbsp; If 90 percent of the population is killed, and the US has 300 million (for easy calculations) that means 30 million people are left.&nbsp; So there are millions of vehicles left.&nbsp; Trade stops?&nbsp; In some places, yes, but in most.&nbsp; And making alcohol and biodiesel is easy.&nbsp; And 30 million people means that they have a lot of stuff to rebuild society.Rope trick or the like.&nbsp; The secretive paranoids are going to survive.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Warren Okuma, post: 3955936, member: 48436"] Pick. Walk. There are tons of small "uneconomical" deposits of coal all over the place, which the major industrial concerns ignore. Salvage solar panels or wind turbines from country homes and get those air pumps to work. Or generators and distil alcohol. Or make a steam engine. And if you can easily make an electrical generator if need be. Hell generator kits are sold to ten year olds (you did check out that link, right?). Mines will be up and running. They can move. Yeah it's a hardship but it beats dying from freezing. Yup. Centers of tech. This was a island situation, so it will not have a desert. I agree with you that desert communities are not going to fare so well. But Texas and other southern states will carry the ball. People move all the time. And there is a huge junkyard full of rusting metal outside of Honolulu. Cranes, tractors, cars, trucks, rebar, and other metal junk that won't be vaporized. They don't put junkyards and dumps near the city. I donno how it's like where you live, but in Hawaii we put junkyards or trash dumps away from the city. Have you been to a major junkyard? If not I suggest you go a visit one, you are going to be in for a treat. Eh, early combustion engines are engines easy to make, and you can distil alcohol or use bio diesel. Not like that's hard to make. Broken engines. Stuff in garbage dumps, stuff in junk yards. Stuff dug out of the ground. Correct. They have to get the communities up and running and power fabrication grids. Long enough to get technology back up and running in that small area. All military vehicles have incredible machine shops. You can just anchor off shore and ferry stuff back and forth. When the ships wear out you salvage the machine shops. We got the point that you will be dead and you will not be able to rebuild civilization. There are tons of machines out in the countyside that can do fabrication. Car repair, tractor repair, general fabrication, contractors, and customizers...quite a few of them are located outside of the city. You measure the part and fabricate it to that specs. The you fit it. If it's too big you work on it some more. You don't have to use brass and copper if you are going to make a crank start engine. Electrical start engines need copper and brass. Yes, normal carbon steel will wear out 5-15% quicker, but you can still build engines. Or you can always overbuild as well. Not really, it's a centuries old tech. And if you want to build a crank start engine, all you need is steel. My cousin built one, and he's not the smartest tool in the shed. He can't walk an chew gum at the same time. Nah, interstate commerce will not break down. Too many work arounds such as distilling alcohol and making biodiesel. And the US oil fields will be up and running hook or by crook. All it is drilling holes and pumping out stuff, if not alcohol or biodiesel. Let's see. If 90 percent of the population is killed, and the US has 300 million (for easy calculations) that means 30 million people are left. So there are millions of vehicles left. Trade stops? In some places, yes, but in most. And making alcohol and biodiesel is easy. And 30 million people means that they have a lot of stuff to rebuild society. Rope trick or the like. The secretive paranoids are going to survive. [/QUOTE]

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