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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8139802" data-attributes="member: 42582">[USER=99817]@chaochou[/USER]'s list seems pretty good.Here's mine:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Burning Wheel (judgement based on a combination of reading and experience)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Prince Valiant (ditto; but there is a caveat - you have to be pretty keen on knight errantry tropes)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Apocalypse World (judgement based on reading alone, much thinking about it, desire to play it)</li> </ul>More qualified:* Marvel Heroic RP/Cortex+ Heroic (I've played a fair bit of it; it's trickier to GM than the first two above and I suspect than AW, and how that is handled has big implications for player agency)* I reckon Classic Traveller is not bad for player agency, but I don't think it's ever going to be as visceral as BW or even Prince Valiant.There are a lot of broadly "process simulation" systems from a broadly similar era - Classic Traveller, RuneQuest, C&S, Rolemaster, Champions/HERO, etc. From the sim perspective they are in many ways rather interchangeable - for instance, I think it's a matter of taste rather than fundamentals whether one prefers to model parry via a roll (RQ), a fixed penalty to the attack (Traveller), or a variable penalty to the attack that reflects the defender's focus on defence vs offence (Rolemaster).But when it comes to player agency there turn out to be real differences across these systems, which I think can be pretty subtle and sometimes need actual play to bring them to light. For instance, RM's ability for a player to determine how much is risked for how big a pay-off both in melee combat and in spell casting makes it better for player agency and thematic input than RQ (and also helps explain why being an archer in RM is lacklustre in comparison to those other two options).That said, I don't think any of them - including Traveller, as I said - are going to get into the same terrain as something like BW. That's a pretty intense RPG!</blockquote>

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