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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8144445" data-attributes="member: 42582">Campbell's second post here sets out the reasons why, for me, &quot;open world&quot; or &quot;sandbox&quot; play does not necessarily support &quot;this sort of agency&quot;.If my PC's goal is to find spellbooks - certainly genre-appropriate in a standard fantasy RPG like D&amp;D or Burning Wheel - and the GM decides that there are no spellbooks in the neighbourhood of my PC, then I can't achieve outcomes not chosen by the GM.If the GM treats my formulation of my PC's goal as a suggestion to include a spellbook in the neighbourhood of my PC, then - as I posted upthread - we are now in a situation where the player is shaping the fiction in ways beyond just describing his/her PC's desires and physical actions. As I posted then, because this is informal and implicit it does not give the player as much agency as more formalised principles, techniques and/or mechanics might. But that doesn't seem to mark any fundamental cleavage about who gets to shape the shared fiction.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 8144445, member: 42582"] Campbell's second post here sets out the reasons why, for me, "open world" or "sandbox" play does not necessarily support "this sort of agency". If my PC's goal is to [I]find spellbooks [/I]- certainly genre-appropriate in a standard fantasy RPG like D&D or Burning Wheel - and the GM decides that there are no spellbooks in the neighbourhood of my PC, then [I]I can't achieve outcomes not chosen by the GM[/I]. If the GM treats my formulation of my PC's goal as a suggestion to include a spellbook in the neighbourhood of my PC, then - as I posted upthread - we are now in a situation where the player is shaping the fiction in ways beyond just describing his/her PC's desires and physical actions. As I posted then, because this is informal and implicit it does not give the player as much agency as more formalised principles, techniques and/or mechanics might. But that doesn't seem to mark any fundamental cleavage about who gets to shape the shared fiction. [/QUOTE]

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