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<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 8148364" data-attributes="member: 82106">This feels a bit overblown to me. I mean, I've been playing this type of games for 12 years now, and I have almost never had a case where a character's thoughts were dictated by the result of resolving a check, a GM framing, etc. [USER=42582]@pemerton[/USER] had an example of a charm spell, and of a situation in Prince Valiant where this kind of thing came up. I'm sure we could come up with charms and dominations and whatnot in D&amp;D as well. We're going to run into these in years of play, but they don't form the mainstay of play, of any type. In fact I'd say the Prince Valiant example is pretty significant here, in that it illustrates that this stuff comes up in games WHICH ARE FOCUSED ON IT. The whole subject is very applicable to Arthurian Romance, Le Morte d'Artur is FILLED with characters possessed by lust, or magic, or whatever, its a trope! That trope is far less likely, usually never does, show up in most other games (when would it show up in Traveller for instance, basically never). I think that we can thus conclude that it isn't a 'type of agency' which is 'disabling' anything. It is a specific genre element of certain games, and one that you would thus accept as a possibility when playing in that genre. Nor does it remove all ability to play your character, it simply imposes an obstacle, a challenge which the player needs to figure out how to overcome or factor into the character's story somehow. Launcelot can still run around and do knightly things, even if he's lusting after the Queen. The player just has to decide if he'll act on those feelings, or not, and if not he may need to validate that with some mechanics perhaps? I don't know PV well enough to know how that works.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 8148364, member: 82106"] This feels a bit overblown to me. I mean, I've been playing this type of games for 12 years now, and I have almost never had a case where a character's thoughts were dictated by the result of resolving a check, a GM framing, etc. [USER=42582]@pemerton[/USER] had an example of a charm spell, and of a situation in Prince Valiant where this kind of thing came up. I'm sure we could come up with charms and dominations and whatnot in D&D as well. We're going to run into these in years of play, but they don't form the mainstay of play, of any type. In fact I'd say the Prince Valiant example is pretty significant here, in that it illustrates that this stuff comes up in games WHICH ARE FOCUSED ON IT. The whole subject is very applicable to Arthurian Romance, Le Morte d'Artur is FILLED with characters possessed by lust, or magic, or whatever, its a trope! That trope is far less likely, usually never does, show up in most other games (when would it show up in Traveller for instance, basically never). I think that we can thus conclude that it isn't a 'type of agency' which is 'disabling' anything. It is a specific genre element of certain games, and one that you would thus accept as a possibility when playing in that genre. Nor does it remove all ability to play your character, it simply imposes an obstacle, a challenge which the player needs to figure out how to overcome or factor into the character's story somehow. Launcelot can still run around and do knightly things, even if he's lusting after the Queen. The player just has to decide if he'll act on those feelings, or not, and if not he may need to validate that with some mechanics perhaps? I don't know PV well enough to know how that works. [/QUOTE]

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