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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Crimson Longinus" data-source="post: 8149610" data-attributes="member: 7025508">But you do. Because everything you say here relies on your Newspeak definition of agency.Yes it does. They're establishing things about the fiction. Earlier several people claimed that player's agency was limited if they were not allowed to introduce some hills in the fiction. So certainly introducing elements in fiction is use of agency. Everything the characters feel, think or say, is an element in the fiction. And just like the hills, it can affect the behaviour of the other characters too.Presumably what happens in a meeting is people talking. Which is a thing that happens. You're trying to slip in here one of your arbitrary imaginary divisions. So now the ability for the players to do what they want without GM stopping them is them having agency... except if what they wanted to do was to talk, then it wasn't... In-character play is a part of the game, thus making decisions about that is making decisions about the content of the game, thus use of agency.Yes! They absolutely do! If they cannot do that, their agency is seriously limited and it is completely bonkers to claim otherwise!Yeah, I'm done with this Czege. It is invoked here like some religious doctrine, and with similar amount of subtlety too. And this is not some pass/fail test, it is a choice. And important, character defining choice. The character is basically choosing to sacrifice one thing that is important to them, they cannot have both. This is truly something. You advocate subjecting important character defining choices for die rolls and think you're advocating for agency!Very early in this thread I talked about not sweating about agency regarding small choices, whether to go to right or left, etc. I said that it is the big choices that matter, love, loyalty, grand goals. This is that sort of a choice. Now having GM to force such choices is of course a no go, but reducing such to some soulless coin flips is almost as bad. So yeah, I'll stick to my version of agency, which means that the players get to control the crucial decision that define their characters.</blockquote>

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