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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8162047" data-attributes="member: 42582">Not very unclear, I don't think. I also think you're more-or-less restating [USER=6923088]@Aebir-Toril[/USER]'s point about the lack of causality/temporal integrity in fiction vis-a-vis the real world.I was going to finish with that, but will add something.Taken in itself, Aebir-Toril's point is pretty self-evident, even trite. The reason it is nevertheless worth stating is because, among RPGers, there is a tendency to treat the fiction as if it itself exercises causal power, or as if the narration of it is constrained by an inner causal or temporal logic (which would be a much much tighter constraint than internal consistency).You can see that happening in this thread, eg when [USER=6795602]@FrogReaver[/USER] confuses the player performing a check that establishes (inter alia) that a tower was built in the imagined past with the character performs an action of recollecting said tower and thereby causes (in the fiction) the tower to exist. And for the avoidance of doubt, here is the post I have in mind:FrogReaver's second case does not exist, and it can only be presented as if it did because of treating an action in the real world whereby a player causing a fiction to be authored/established and an action performed by an imaginary character that produces an imagined causal change in the character's imagined world as if they are the same, or at least in causal interaction with one another.</blockquote>

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