Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="pawsplay" data-source="post: 5451962" data-attributes="member: 15538">I just don't get that. &quot;Both your attacks will take a huge minus to hit,&quot; for instance, is about as unambiguous as you can get. Suboptimal results happen. &quot;I try to jump the chasm, how far is it?&quot; &quot;Ten feet. Roll your Jump skill.&quot; &quot;What do I need to roll?&quot; &quot;You need a 15.&quot; &quot;Oh.&quot;There are some people that are naturally drawn to 4e's tropes. I believe most people, though, are put off right from the beginning from having to learn what funny little symbols mean just to use your abilities. Once you grasp what a &quot;Daily&quot; is, then you can activate it, but there isn't any clear guidance to a new person as to when you should do that. 4e has a semblance of simplicity, because most of its tactical resolution can be described as &quot;I use X on Y,&quot; but that conceals a multitude of sub-systems that make 4e work. In actuality, 4e is quite complex. Not as complex as Rolemaster, but IMO probably moreso than 3e. 3e asks you to learn maybe twenty new words to make it through your first encounter; 4e requires double that, plus a familiarity with weird symbols. The notecard format of a power might say &quot;push an opponent two squares&quot; but that requires you know what pushing is and what a square means in tactical terms. Even though the information is compacted, it's the same level of detail 3e requires. But it's not as flexible. Way too often, 4e is going to say, &quot;Sorry, we don't know how to do that.&quot;</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pawsplay, post: 5451962, member: 15538"] I just don't get that. "Both your attacks will take a huge minus to hit," for instance, is about as unambiguous as you can get. Suboptimal results happen. "I try to jump the chasm, how far is it?" "Ten feet. Roll your Jump skill." "What do I need to roll?" "You need a 15." "Oh." There are some people that are naturally drawn to 4e's tropes. I believe most people, though, are put off right from the beginning from having to learn what funny little symbols mean just to use your abilities. Once you grasp what a "Daily" is, then you can activate it, but there isn't any clear guidance to a new person as to when you should do that. 4e has a semblance of simplicity, because most of its tactical resolution can be described as "I use X on Y," but that conceals a multitude of sub-systems that make 4e work. In actuality, 4e is quite complex. Not as complex as Rolemaster, but IMO probably moreso than 3e. 3e asks you to learn maybe twenty new words to make it through your first encounter; 4e requires double that, plus a familiarity with weird symbols. The notecard format of a power might say "push an opponent two squares" but that requires you know what pushing is and what a square means in tactical terms. Even though the information is compacted, it's the same level of detail 3e requires. But it's not as flexible. Way too often, 4e is going to say, "Sorry, we don't know how to do that." [/QUOTE]

Verification