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<blockquote data-quote="bloodtide" data-source="post: 8933189" data-attributes="member: 6684958">I'm not sure many RPGs has a shared fiction.&nbsp; I mean it sounds good when like written on the cover of an RPG book, but does not mean much.The typical GM is sharing the fiction they made, as that is the whole base of most any RPG.&nbsp; But few players what to &quot;share&quot; , they want to &quot;disrupt&quot; or even &quot;destroy&quot;.&nbsp; The reason is simple, the GM cares about all the players and the game.&nbsp; The player only cares about themselves.&nbsp; And sure there are all the Other Games made specifically to not be D&amp;D.&nbsp; They feature things like hard, harsh rule limits on what the GM can do.&nbsp; And on the other side the player get the ability to alter reality.&nbsp; But this is not a shared fiction either, as the game just switched the GM and players power and that is it.And, your Torchbearer example, is that accurate? The players can NEVER fail a dice roll?&nbsp; Well, why even roll the dice then?&nbsp; Just sit down to play the game for a couple seconds, tell the players they won the game, and then do something else.&nbsp; I guess you said the GM can say &quot;you failed the pointless roll, but auto do it&quot; and give a penalty.&nbsp; But is this a typical RPG penalty like &quot;oh you get&nbsp; a -1 to rolls&quot; for an hour, that does not really mean anything.&nbsp; You can't ever fail, right, so any penalty is meaningless.&nbsp; Or can the penalty be like &quot;go sit in the corner you can't play for an hour&quot;?&nbsp; Or a &quot;twist&quot;?&nbsp; But they still auto succeed.&nbsp; So the twist can't effect that right?&nbsp; So this seems a bit pointless too.&nbsp; The GM says &quot;well your one armed weak halfling automatically opens the thirty foot tall solid iron magically locked door after rolling a two....but, oh look, it starts to rain!&nbsp; What a Twist!&quot;Or is there a bit more detail here?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="bloodtide, post: 8933189, member: 6684958"] I'm not sure many RPGs has a shared fiction. I mean it sounds good when like written on the cover of an RPG book, but does not mean much. The typical GM is sharing the fiction they made, as that is the whole base of most any RPG. But few players what to "share" , they want to "disrupt" or even "destroy". The reason is simple, the GM cares about all the players and the game. The player only cares about themselves. And sure there are all the Other Games made specifically to not be D&D. They feature things like hard, harsh rule limits on what the GM can do. And on the other side the player get the ability to alter reality. But this is not a shared fiction either, as the game just switched the GM and players power and that is it. And, your Torchbearer example, is that accurate? The players can NEVER fail a dice roll? Well, why even roll the dice then? Just sit down to play the game for a couple seconds, tell the players they won the game, and then do something else. I guess you said the GM can say "you failed the pointless roll, but auto do it" and give a penalty. But is this a typical RPG penalty like "oh you get a -1 to rolls" for an hour, that does not really mean anything. You can't ever fail, right, so any penalty is meaningless. Or can the penalty be like "go sit in the corner you can't play for an hour"? Or a "twist"? But they still auto succeed. So the twist can't effect that right? So this seems a bit pointless too. The GM says "well your one armed weak halfling automatically opens the thirty foot tall solid iron magically locked door after rolling a two....but, oh look, it starts to rain! What a Twist!" Or is there a bit more detail here? [/QUOTE]

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